{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/7h1dj59k10/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Tilman, David"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/115/original/Boxed_Milken_Center_logo.png?1628711583","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Preferred Citation"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eTilman, David. 2019. Interview by Jeff Janeczko and Mark Kligman. Milken Archive Oral History Project. 19 July.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publisher"]},"value":{"en":["Milken Family Foundation"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003e© Milken Family Foundation. Unauthorized use is prohibited. For inquiries, please contact info@milkenarchive.org.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Tilman, David (Cantor/Hazzan)","Janeczko, Jeff (Interviewer)","Kligman, Mark (Interviewer)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2019-07-19"]}},{"label":{"en":["Coverage"]},"value":{"en":["Elkins Park, PA (Place of Recording)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":["English (Primary)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eOral history interview with David Tilman detailing his career as a prominent American cantor. Tilman grew from humble beginnings in Albany, New York, as the child of immigrant parents to serve as Hazzan Sheni to Cantor David Putterman at New York’s Park Avenue Synagogue. After several years at the Park Avenue Synagogue, Tilman accepted a position at Congregation Beth Shalom in Elkins Park, Pennsylvania, where established a significant musical program and served for more than three decades.\u003c/p\u003e"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eOral history interview with David Tilman detailing his career as a prominent American cantor. Tilman grew from humble beginnings in Albany, New York, as the child of immigrant parents to serve as Hazzan Sheni to Cantor David Putterman at New York\u0026rsquo;s Park Avenue Synagogue. After several years at the Park Avenue Synagogue, Tilman accepted a position at Congregation Beth Shalom in Elkins Park, Pennsylvania, where established a significant musical program and served for more than three decades.\u003c/p\u003e"]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003e\u0026copy; Milken Family Foundation. Unauthorized use is prohibited. For inquiries, please contact info@milkenarchive.org.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Lowell Milken Center for Music of American Jewish Experience"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Lowell Milken Center for Music of American Jewish Experience"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/115/original/Boxed_Milken_Center_logo.png?1628711583","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/187/974/small/Screenshot_2023-06-23_at_9.07.40_AM.png?1687536521","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - 23050_David_Tillman_FINAL_Oral_History.mp4"]},"duration":6776.60444,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/187/974/small/Screenshot_2023-06-23_at_9.07.40_AM.png?1687536521","type":"Image","format":"image/png"}],"items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-milken.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/187/974/original/23050_David_Tillman_FINAL_Oral_History.mp4?1684529166","type":"Video","format":"video/mp4","duration":6776.60444,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["David Tilman Corrected July 2023 [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: I was born September 14th, 1944 in Albany, New York, to first generation immigrant parents who came to the United States and met each other and got to Albany. And I grew up in a conservative congregation, a small congregation called Ohav Sholom and then in 1957, right after my bar mitzvah we moved to Temple Israel in Albany, which was this wonderfully large, dynamic congregation with a fabulous staff, particularly a fabulous hazzan, a fabulous cantor, who, when I met in 1957, changed my life forever. His name was Rabbi Cantor Herbert Feder, F-e-d-e-r. And I met him in the fall of 1957 and he stayed a life-long friend and a mentor all his life. He just died two years ago.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: We'll talk about him a little bit more. Briefly, could you talk a little bit about your parents, the circumstances surrounding their births and how you all wound up in Albany?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=15.0,88.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e My father was born in a town called Rzeszow which is 60 kilometers due east of Warsaw. He...it's also pronounced \"Rusjony\" [ph]--Rusjony, [ph], Rzeszow. He came to the United States in 1921 with his parents, his grandparents, and his younger brother and sister. They all came to Ellis Island and then went to West New York, New Jersey, right across the river where they had a cousin who they stayed with for a few years and then moved to Albany because there was an uncle, Uncle Julius who had a farm in Albany. And they moved to Albany and lived there for a while on [sic] my father's family.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=88.0,138.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And then my mother came from the Austrian-Hungarian empire and also came to the United States, the same year, 1921. She grew up in the Bronx, went to Julia Richmond High School. And her--my mother's dentist, as I recall, my mother's dentist was a brother-in-law to my father's mother. And it was--he said, maybe Hannah you want to meet my nephew Alex and he's in Albany. And so I think either she went up there or he came to New York and they met each other and a romance blossomed and they got married in 1939.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=138.0,186.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: I was born in 1944. I'm an only child. They joined a small--smaller conservative congregation called Congregation Ohav Shalom--Ohav Shalom as they pronounced it in Albany. And I went to public school, all my whole, early education to school 16, William S. Hackett Junior High and Albany High School and...but I went to Hebrew school and became very involved in the synagogue life. From an early point I remember playing accordion at a...at the synagogue when I was very, very young. And then, as I said before, we joined this Temple Israel, which was this wonderful, wonderful congregation and stayed there throughout high school, through my high school years. Very involved in the high school program and the youth program and particularly in the musical life of Temple Israel in those early years.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: How did your family earn a living in Albany?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=186.0,251.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e My father was a small businessman. He had a paint and wallpaper store in the old Jewish neighborhood in the south end of Albany. It was a retail store and he also sold to contractors, to paint contractors. My mother, when I was in junior high, I believe, right after my bar mitzvah went to work for the State of New York, which was the biggest employer. As you can imagine, Albany is the state capital and she worked...I forget the grade, it was certain grades, civil servant that she was, but she worked her way up in the insurance division of--insurance department of the State of New York. And did that until almost a year or two before she died. She died rather young; unfortunately, she was 55 when she died, but she worked--my father had the paint store and my mother worked for the State of New York.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=251.0,303.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJEFF JANECZKO:\u003c/strong\u003e And you mentioned getting involved in synagogue fairly early on. Could you talk a little more about the role Judaism played in your life as you were growing up?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=303.0,313.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e We were a classical American conservative family in that the synagogue played a very important role. We were not a totally observant home. We were observant in the home, not necessarily out of the home. That changed as I got older. I...based on the educational experience that I had both--first in this Ohav Shalom Congregation and later Temple Israel--I became more involved in Jewish life. And because of me, my family made their home kosher. And that's a classic story. Children of--people of my generation in the conservative movement all had that kind of impact on their families.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=313.0,364.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And synagogue life was very important to me from a very early age. I remember having--I remember being at age 10...at age 10 being elected president of the junior congregation of Congregation Ohav Shalom. And I remember presiding at services and announcing pages and leading the davening when I was 10, 11 and 12. And for a group of children that were--group of about 30 or 40 children that came to shul every Shabbat. So those things were very important to me. Very important to me, I loved the davening. I love the--I love leading the services and I love the ritual, the ritual that I learned to do as a child. It became very, very important.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: Can you tell us a little bit about your bar mitzvah?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=364.0,412.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, I can take the rest of the video to tell you about my bar mitzvah. My bar mitzvah occurred on September 14th, 1957. Now, I'm going to--I have to preface this by telling you that I'm an only child. So not only an only child of my parents, but my father had a brother and a sister who were married with no children. So I'm the only child of all of them and my grandparents. So my bar mitzvah was a big deal. And it took place in this Ohav Shalom Congregation, a kind of middle-size conservative congregation. I remember the room was filled.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=412.0,448.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I remember that I read four aliyot and Parashat Ki Tavo in the book of Devarim, book of Deuteronomy. I remembered that I led Mussaf. I led the additional service, and everybody loved that. Everybody thought that was really wonderful. We had a nice big reception after that. We had a much more formal reception Sunday night. I can share with you even that my--I had a cousin, a first cousin, my cousin Larry, who had his bar mitzvah in the Bronx in June of the same year, of 1957. And in the Bronx they used to do it...at the party they used to call--do a thing called the Talis Investiture Service that they would do at the catering hall.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=448.0,495.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And my parents and I loved that so much that we copied that. We emulated this Talis Investiture Service and it began the Sunday night party with this service of my parents presenting me with the Tallit in the sanctuary and we walked down the aisle and the cantor sang something or other and all that. So I...but my bar mitzvah was very pivotal and very, very beautiful. Very beautiful.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: Was that aspect of the bar mitzvah, the ceremony, was that unique?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=495.0,524.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e In Albany, yeah, that Talis Investiture Service was most definitely unique and it never happened before in Albany, never. Never. In hindsight I think that...it was this--my cousin's bar mitzvah took place in a catering hall on the grand concourse in the Bronx and, yeah, I think probably this was a ceremony invented by the caterers so they could get the maximum use of their facility.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=524.0,554.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And they hired a cantor and a choir just for this Talis Investiture Service, who I remember the cantor, his name was Aralan Diamond [ph], who was a cantor in New York, wonderful, wonderful cantor. But he would do weddings and bar mitzvah parties and High Holy Day somewhere, somewhere or other, and he was a fabulous cantor. Big, beefy tenor. And that was part of the Saturday night ritual at this catering hall in the Bronx. And we...we then took it to Albany and restaged the whole thing.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: What role did music play in your early...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=554.0,593.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Mr. Martin Ainspan was a member of the smallest synagogue. And he had a studio called the Albany Accordion Center. And he taught accordion. The accordion was a very popular instrument in the 1950s. And he taught accordion to a lot of students.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=593.0,617.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I'll tell you a funny--I mean, again, I remember this quite vividly. It was a Hanukkah assembly and my best friend, whose name was Avram, Avram Tabatchnik [ph], he got up to play \"Rock of Ages,\" which is a Hanukkah song on his accordion. And he got through the first four measures and stopped and then asked his father to bring up the music. His father came up and held the sheet music in front of him and he got though another four measures, maybe he got through eight measures, sixteenth measures, and he announced to the people at the party, he said, \"well, I only had the piece one week,\" and stormed off the stage and everybody applauded for him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=617.0,658.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I remember turning to my mother, a blessed memory, I said, you know, I think I could do better than that. And so that week my mother made an appointment with Mr. Ainspan and I met him that week and took accordion lessons. Seriously, serious accordion lessons for about--now I was eight years old, I took lessons through my sixteenth--to the time I was 16. Accordion became a very important part of how I defined myself and that started when I was eight years old. When I was eight years old, I think that I admitted to myself that I had a modicum of musical talent. Two quick stories I will share with you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=658.0,700.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I was maybe a 10, 11 years old, and I went to a wonderful day camp in Albany and they had a musical presentation at the end of the eighth week and I played a solo called \"Teddy Bear's Picnic\" on the accordion. [Sings] \"If you go down to the youth...\" [making musical noises] and I played that, and everybody loved that. And then a number of years later, not that many years later, in the summer of 1959, I found myself--I was a camper for the first time at Camp Ramah in East Hampton, Connecticut. Ramah was--it is--the camping movement of the conservative movement. At that time, there were four Ramah camps. And from Albany we went to the camp in East Hampton, Connecticut.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=700.0,753.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I went there and the dance counselor, whose name...her name was Nava Bender, she recruited me to play the music for the dance festival, for the Rikkudiah. And she essentially gave me, and the music director gave me, lead sheets. A lead sheet is a melody line with chord names, for about 25 Israeli dances. And I must have practiced four or five hours a day for 10 days; two weeks in camp time, that's an eternity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=753.0,789.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And I did that and there was a flautist and a drummer. And it was a major musical event in my life, that moment. That moment playing for that dance festival. And I remember thinking when it was over that, you know, I have a little bit of ability. A little bit of talent. I didn't use that word, but I remember thinking that there's something here I have to explore in a deeper way.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: And what age was that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=789.0,827.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: I was 14. I was going to be 15--I was 14, in August of 1959, I was going to be 15 in September. It was the summer between the 9th and 10th grade.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: So how did you put Judaism and music together and through experiences like this? Are there other experiences in which those two came together for you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=827.0,849.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, how did I put music together with my Jewish identity? I think it's a really good question. I think that my accordion teacher probably gave me certain music books that had Jewish content. And here, I remember quiet vividly there were--I remember there was a music publisher in Manhattan called Metro Music, M-e-t-r-o, Metro Music. They were located on Second Avenue and Third Street. They were both a retail store and a publisher. And Metro published a number of early collections of Israeli songs and Jewish songs. And I think that this accordion teacher must have tracked down those books and got them for me and I began playing the tunes in that album, in that collection.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=849.0,902.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I also think I began...I developed--again, based on the Ramah experience, I began buying Israeli recordings both made in Israel and made in the United States. I was a very early fan of Theodore Bikel and the albums that he recorded for Electra. Electra was the label that he recorded on. He told me that himself. A blessed memory. I did a--I got to know him a little bit. I did a big, big, event with him in this community. And I began buying those albums.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=902.0,939.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And then this man that I mentioned earlier, this Rabbi Cantor Herbert Feder, who later in his life went by the name of Avraham Feder, was a charismatic, dynamic, unbelievable human being. Talented, magnificent baritone, a mensch, everything. Everything. And I was maybe 13, it was right after--I was 13, right after we moved from this smaller congregation, Ohav Shalom, to Temple Israel and he came to me a Shabbat morning. I remember the place and I remember the moment that he said to me in his bravado style, he said, \"David, I hear you're a musical fellow. Why don't you come to the Temple Israel youth choir this afternoon at 3:00 o'clock?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=939.0,993.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I remember running home to my mother, a blessed memory, and asking her permission. I said, \"Cantor Feder wants me in the youth choir, I really want to go.\" And she said, \"Go.\" So I ran back to Temple Israel and that set me on a direction. That set me on a direction. Now, he was...so many aspects to him. And I began accompanying him on the accordion. I remember going with him to a TV show and doing a Hanukkah program and playing Hanukkah songs for Cantor Feder on Channel 6 in Schenectady, New York, I think it was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=993.0,1036.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I remember Shabbat morning sitting and I wouldn't...I was a very social guy with a lot of friends, but I wouldn't let anybody sit with me because I had a focus on what Cantor Feder was doing. I had to get into every nuance of every vocal move that he made. And he began teaching me High Holy Day davening and Shabbat davening and I just loved to hang with him. I loved to be with him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1036.0,1065.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e There was this--we had this youth choir, as I told you, and he taught us...in hindsight he taught us all these songs he learned in the Lower East Side of Manhattan where he grew up. And there were about 35 teenagers. And I remember the moment. I remember the moment. They had this little ritual where the cantor and the rabbi would walk off the bima, it was a very large bima and they would march down the center aisle to the back of the room to greet everybody after Adon Olam was over, as the congregation would exit the room.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1065.0,1099.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So he quite spontaneously...the choir--the youth choir is signing Adon Olam, he grabbed me by the wrist, put me in front of the choir. He put me in the front of the choir and he whispered to me, \"conduct.\" So I did something or other. I did something or other and from that a career was born, I guess, from that one moment. From that one moment. So he always used to refer to it, I read it last night in the...and he has a letter, Rabbi Cantor Feder has a letter in the journal--in the book that this synagogue published when I retired here, 2011. And I read--I reread it last night, I hadn't read it in a long time. I reread last night the letter that this--that Herb Feder wrote for this journal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1099.0,1150.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And he describes this moment where he started a band, a band of teenagers and he said \"I was the titular conductor but I depended on you to get me through, to teach me what I had to know about transpositions and everything else.\" And somehow I knew those things when I was 15 and 16 and was able to guide him, Cantor Feder, through the maintenance and running of this group of teenagers playing all that music from Metro Music--from the Metro album where there was a series of freilachs in the Kammen, K-a-m-m-e-n. Kammen International Folio, freilach one, freilach two, freilach three, freilach four.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1150.0,1197.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: They published all the violin part and the clarinet part and the trumpet part and the keyboard part and the accordion part and so I remember we played all of that music. And this was--I was 15, 16 years old.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: And I know we will get to this a bit later, but did that experience of him putting you in a position of leadership to be influential to--as a teacher yourself, did you use that model?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1197.0,1220.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, of course. Of course. It's no question. There's  no question that I wanted to emulate this Cantor Feder in every way I could possibly do. And he, you know, in a spiritual way, in a spiritual way he'd sing shochen ad, he'd daven, you know and I felt that the kodesh borekhu, that the holy one blessed--the holy one...entered the room when Cantor Feder opened his mouth and the congregation sang with him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1220.0,1244.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And I definitely...that moved me. It moved me and it--he gave me a role model. He gave me a role model. I didn't come back to that role model right...I didn't act on that role model immediately. It took me a long--it took me a number of years to come back to that, but there's no question that that was--all the experiences were pivotal to me. Pivotal.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: That's great. You want to tell us about what lead you into college and then studying at JTS?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1244.0,1278.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e What led me into college. Well, I should tell you, I should preface that by telling you that I was very much a student of John Fitzgerald Kennedy. He should rest in peace. And when President Kennedy mandated that we go to the moon by 1969. I was also...in hindsight, today you would call my interest in those days--in addition to the musical life--I was very much a techie. Very much a techie. I liked early stereo equipment. I remember building a one-tube radio. I remember building a little crystal set that I wore on my belt.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1278.0,1320.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And so...when I went to college, I very much wanted to be an aeronautical engineer. And so I went to Columbia College because Columbia College in New York, first of all, has an incredible Jewish life there. Secondly, I could...my plan was to go to the engineering--to the Columbia College for three years, and then transfer to the engineering school for year four and five and they would grant two bachelor's degrees, a B.A. from Columbia College and a B.S. from the engineering school.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1320.0,1358.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And my goal was to get this degree in aeronautical engineering, or what they called flight sciences. I was kind of disabused of that rather quickly. One, because I got to Columbia from Albany, New York to encounter all these young men from Bronx Heights, who all knew calculus already and I had not. I barely could spell the word. I...that's all I knew about calculus. And I knew that I was just not going to be able to keep up with these guys with regard to math and physics and stuff like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1358.0,1394.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e On a positive side, I took two classes in my freshman year. Columbia had this music requirement called a music humanities. And it was a revelation to me because, again, I was by this point a good accordion player. I had great facility on the instrument, still do. A great facility in playing. And, but I didn't know a lot about music history or where everything just lay chronologically, I didn't know. So this class, this music humanities, this one semester class, was an eye-opener for me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1394.0,1432.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And with regard to harmony and counterpoint and Bach and Beethoven and Mozart and Brahms and Gershwin and all--but even Leonard Bernstein, you know, even in his early 60s I think I was aware of who he was--I know I was. Of course, I was aware of who he was. And this class did that for me. And then the second class that I took because I had finished my language requirement was a class in the religion department, the religion department. I wound up majoring in the academic study of religion, what they called in German Religionswissenschaft with a music concentrate. With a music concentrate.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1432.0,1474.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I applied initially with not an open heart, with not a great heart. With not a full heart. I applied initially to rabbinical school at the Jewish Theological Seminary to kind of see if I could sort things out a little bit. And I went to rabbinical school because the synagogue in Albany, this Temple Israel in Albany had a whole history of sending young men to the Jewish Theological Seminary, to the rabbinic school and I was kind of the next one in line from Temple Israel to go to rabbinical school.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1474.0,1509.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I went to rabbinical school and I was there for one year with not a great amount of love. So after the year was over, I decided to take a year off and take piano lessons. I wanted to study piano formally, which I did. I had also started working at Ramah, working at Camp Ramah. And my first summer working at Ramah was in Ramah--Camp Ramah, Wingdale, New York in what they call today Ramah in the Berkshires in 1965.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1509.0,1542.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I got to Ramah in 1965, having done...back to Albany, we had a day camp, a Jewish day camp called Camp Kiva and I learned how to do a camp music program at Camp Kiva. So I got to--I get to Ramah in the Berkshires in 1965 and the head music counselor was Velvel Pasternak, a blessed memory. It was a great influence on me. A great influence on me. And so I had done--I began doing--working up the Ramah ladder; assistant music counselor, associate music director.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1542.0,1576.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Finally in 1969 I ascended to be Rosch Musica [ph], as we call it [Hebrew], to be music director of Camp Ramah in the Berkshires. But what happened was that all the seminary faculty sent their kids to Ramah in the Berkshires and they would go home, these children--the children of Rabbi David Kogan [ph] and others, the children of Rabbi Wolf Kelman [ph], they would go home and tell their parents, you know, we had this Rosch Musica [ph] David Tilman who was really somebody. So I developed this musical reputation amongst the JTS leadership.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1576.0,1617.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So it's now summer of 1968 and Rabbi Kogan comes to visit his children at Ramah in the Berkshires. And he sits me down and I had kind of made up my mind without a great investment of my soul that I was going to return to rabbinical school. And so he sat me down and he said, \"you know David, the Cantors Institute has this wonderful group of young men and maybe you should think about coming to the cantorial school.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1617.0,1651.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I ran down to the pay phone to call Rabbi Feder, who was then in Toronto. I said, \"Herb, David Kogan suggests that I want--I should apply to the cantorial school, Cantors Institute at the Jewish Theological Seminary. What do you think?\" And he said to me, \"David, I'm not good at giving advice, but at least try it, maybe you'll eliminate another set of circumstances for yourself.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1651.0,1684.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So that fall, fall of 1968, I took the entrance exams and went for the interviews with Hugo Weisgall, and Max Wohlberg, and Mariam Gideon, those lead--the great faculty at the Cantorial School at those times and they took me, and I went there and I thought it was...I thought I belonged there. It really felt like that's where I should be. I never felt--you know, I felt I had a lot of work to do vocally. I felt I wasn't--I had a lot to do to make myself a better technical baritone, a better singer. And that was an area of deficiency that I worked very hard at.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1684.0,1727.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And then in...in the spring of 1969 Cantor Wohlberg who was the [Hebrew] called me into the closet behind his room. He says to me, \"David, you...\"--and I don't know if you ever met him in--he had this little bit of a Hungarian accent. He said, \"David, how would you like to start your career at the top.\" And he emphasized that final P. And I said, \"what do you mean?\" He said, \"Hazzan Putterman at the Park Avenue Synagogue is looking for a new Hazzan Sheni, a new assistant cantor. And I think you would be the perfect candidate for him.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1727.0,1762.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I met with Hazzan Putterman and I met with Rabbi Judah Nadich, a blessed memory, and I went through an interview Shabbat where I had to go and daven Shabbat Mincha before [Hebrew] Shabbat Friday night and I had to read the Torah Saturday morning, which was a job to prepare properly. Then I had to do Shabbat Mincha Saturday afternoon. And Saturday night Hazzan Putterman sat down and offered me the job to be his Hazzan Sheni beginning in August of...it wasn't August, it was September, September 1, right after Labor Day of 1969.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1762.0,1802.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I remember saying to Hazzan Putterman, \"Hazzan Putterman, I want to ask my father.\" My mother had died earlier and I'm an only child. I said I want to ask my father. So he said to me, Cantor Putterman, \"David darling, I'm offering you the job to be my Hazzan Sheni. What more do you need to know?\" In his somewhat gregarious and self-centered nature. I said I have to--must--ask my father. So I asked my father and I decided to go ahead with that adventure, which was quite an adventure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1802.0,1836.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: Not an easy adventure, it was a very demanding time because I was in school full time at the Park Avenue Synagogue. I take that back. I was in school full time at the cantorial school of the Jewish Theological Seminary, and I was Hazzan Sheni at the Park Avenue Synagogue training banae [Hebrew], teaching music in the religious school and getting myself ready for Shabbat every morning.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: What an incredible experience.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1836.0,1857.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: Yep, it was. I met some unbelievable people, unbelievable people and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: That was 1969 until when?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1857.0,1866.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e 1975. What happened was, I'm due to graduate the Jewish Seminary, the cantorial school with a Hazzan diploma and the bachelor of sacred music in June of 1971. And the [Hebrew], master of the universe works in strange ways. I got very sick. I got pneumonia in my right lung and I wind up in Montefiore Hospital in the Bronx and right at the time when all my colleagues were interviewing for positions. And I get out of the hospital after two weeks rather weak, unable to even think about an interview. And so I decided to take this--I decided to stay at the Park Avenue Synagogue at least for one more year and I spent the summer of 1971 preparing for the choral conducting audition at the Juilliard School.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1866.0,1928.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I--that summer I did not work. I had...I was in New York doing my Hazzan Sheni responsibilities, which weren't demanding during the week, it was all on the weekend. So during the week I could really learn the music that I had to learn to go through the audition for Mr. Abraham Kaplan who was the next great hashpia'ah, the next great influence on my life and who was director of choral activities and teacher of choral conducting at the Julliard School and preparing for that audition. And I took that audition; it required--there were like seven pieces I had to prepare.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1928.0,1969.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I remember walking into this room at the Juilliard School in the new building already on 66th Street and Broadway, and being confronted by 24 professional singers; six sopranos, altos, tenors, basses. And Mr. Kaplan, along with the orchestral conducting teacher, whose name I do not remember said, \"Mr. Tilman, the podium is yours, you pick the first piece.\" So I remember picking, I think it was something from Jesu, meine Freude, a Bach Motet number three. And I worked on that--it was a rehearsal. It was a working rehearsal with these 24 professional signers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=1969.0,2008.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I remember guiding them through somehow the opening chorale of that...and then Mr. Kaplan picked a piece by Vincent Persichetti who was a contemporary composer, one of the Julliard virtuoso composers at the time. So they picked that piece, Mr. Kaplan and the other people on the jury. And so I--they didn't even let me start at the beginning. He said start the Persichetti from rehearsal letter B, measure 42, or something or other. So I asked the pianist for the note and I took off and that lasted another 8 to 10 minutes and then they stopped me and \"thank you very much.\" And 48 hours later I had a letter, welcome to the Julliard School. So my...that began that next academic experience.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2008.0,2056.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: So I was at Juilliard from September of 1971 through June of 1975 and continuing to function as Hazzan Sheni at the Park Avenue Synagogue during that entire period, leading this kind of double life as a graduate music student at the Julliard School and as a member of the clergy at the Park Avenue Synagogue. And I remember I had to--I would get out of, finish Julliard at 4:00 o'clock in the afternoon and I knew just how to run to Central Park West on 66th Street and get a cab to get me to the Park Avenue Synagogue by--in 10 minutes to meet my bar mitzvah students at 4:15. And I would do that four days a week. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: Can you tell us in just a few minutes or briefly, about Abraham Kaplan and what impact that he had on you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2056.0,2110.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Mr. Kaplan was first and foremost an incredible, incredibly beautiful conductor. I had met him earlier, a number of years earlier because Hazzan Putterman had this annual service that he would commission composers. And they would present this commission, this commission piece, it was always the first Friday night in May. First Friday night in May of the year. And so Mister--Hazzan Putterman would hire Abe Kaplan to come over and conduct the Park Avenue Synagogue quartet, supplemented by another eight singers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2110.0,2147.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e They would have 12 pros. And I remember watching Mr. Kaplan conduct these rehearsals and being totally mesmerized by the elegance. He was an unbelievably elegant conductor. And he knew just what he wanted. He knew how to get those results and I remember thinking, I want to spend time with this man. He was also very much a secular Jew. A secular Jew. A little aside to that experience, I met Mr. Kaplan in an academic sense beginning in September of 1971.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2147.0,2185.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e In February of 1972 my grandpa back in Albany, Mayor Lade [ph] Tilman died and I went to the funeral back in Albany. And someone comes to the Shiva and a man who was a lantzman of my family and he says to me, he says, \"I hear you're a student of Abraham Kaplan.\" I said, \"yes.\" He said, \"do you know who Mr. Kaplan is?\" I said \"of course I know him. That's why I'm studying with him.\" He said, \"do you really know who he is?\" And I said, \"what are you telling me?\" He tells me that Mr. Kaplan's grandpa, Gershon Kaplan, was the Hazzan of the great synagogue in Rzeszow, the same synagogue where my father's family came. Probably was the Hazzan at my father's bar mitzvah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2185.0,2233.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I went back to New York and with somewhat bated breath, because I--it was very hard to talk Jewish issues with Mr. Kaplan. He was a real secular Jew and I opened up to him. I said I just heard this, that are a Rzeszower, the way I'm a Rzeszower. And he liked that. He liked that. So we had that extra bond. That extra bond that we didn't talk about, certainly not at the Julliard School. But we had that extra bond of both of us having similar lineage. I've stayed in touch with Mr. Kaplan to this day. To this day.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2233.0,2275.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Four years ago, five years ago, I was five years adjunct associate professor at JTS after I left Beth Shalom and so Mr. Kaplan offered me the opportunity to do the New York premiere of a piece he wrote about Hanukkah, \"Eight Days of Hanukkah.\" So I did the piece and he came in for that. I hadn't seen him for many, many years before he came in for that. And that was quite an experience to conduct that premiere and he's pressed--I told the students at JTS I said, look, I have to show Mr. Kaplan that I've done something with what he taught me, with what he taught me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2275.0,2314.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And so, I've stayed in touch with him, I've stayed in touch with him. He's now in his late 80s, just moved to a senior citizen apartment in Baltimore where he has his son. So we are in touch, we're in touch. But he was an elegant conductor, meticulously prepared. Had this relationship with Bernstein, you know he did all of the choral prep for the Kaddish Symphony and Chichester Psalms, the premiere records. And so he did all of Bernstein's choral work in the New York Philharmonic. A very pivotal person for me, no question. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: Do you want to move on to coming here to Beth Shalom?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: I wanted to first ask about David Putterman and what he was like, what your relationship with him was like, and a little bit more detail about those years you spent at the Park Avenue Synagogue.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2314.0,2366.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Hazzan David Putterman was a complex person. He really created the position of the American conservative cantor. He saw himself, and without exaggeration I think it was true, as the creator of the conservative cantorate. He felt he was the creator of the cantorial school at JTS, he felt he was the creator of the Cantor's Assembly, the professional organization of American cantors. He was demanding of everybody around him and very demanding on me. And he was--he had a fiery temper. A fiery temper.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2366.0,2408.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e The issues that would provoke him had to do with the daily work of preparing bar and bah mitzvah students at the Park Avenue Synagogue. It would be up to me to prepare him--prepare these children to a month before. They would meet the Hazzan a month before their date--a month before their date they would meet Hazzan Putterman and he was a very intimidating person. And so the children, whatever they were prepared to do would kind of collapse in withering fear of being reprimanded by Hazzan Putterman and he then would take it out on me, that child A, B, and C was less than prepared. And we got over that. We got over that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2408.0,2456.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e He did not approve of my getting an education as a conductor. He said, you want to be a Hazzan, what do you have to study conducting for? Study Nusach, study voice, study repertoire, but why do you need to study to be a conductor? Another person can do that for you. So that was an ongoing issue that he felt with me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2456.0,2482.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I'll tell you that I came here in 1975. He died in, I believe, 1977 and his wife calls me--called me here in Philadelphia and she said, \"he's dying but he doesn't want any visitors.\" So I remember saying to myself, if he didn't want any visitors what did she call me for? So I cancelled all my appointments here for whatever I had that day and I grabbed the train and went right to Mt. Sinai Hospital in Manhattan and went right into his room in the CCU, coronary care unit, at Mt. Sinai Hospital.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2482.0,2522.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e He grabbed my arm and he wouldn't let go of me for 45 minutes. And after, ultimately, the nurse came to remove me from his vice grip and he sat up in bed, took the oxygen off of his face, grabbed my face with two hands and kissed me on the lips. And he said, \"give my love to all who know me.\" And he flopped back in bed, 24 hours later he's dead. He's dead. So he loved me. He told his sons that I was his third son. But he was a difficult man. Very demanding man; demanding on himself, demanding all people around him. His way was the only way to do things. And that's not the easiest personality to be with.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2522.0,2577.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: But did I learn from him? Did I learn from him what the most established cantor in America was doing? Did I learn repertoire from him? I learned a style of a pulpit. I learned his interaction with congregants; his interaction with the rabbi. He was an incredible pastor. He would visit people in the hospital, write them handwritten notes. Wonderful --gave wonderful eulogies at funerals. He...there was a lot going on that was wonderful with Cantor Putterman, but along with that came this other sordid aspects of his personality. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: When you say that he created the conservative--the position of the conservative cantor, could you explain to me what that means, or how that might be different from, you know, what was happening in other branches of Judaism at the time?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2577.0,2637.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e The cantorate was not a well-organized profession. As far as I know in the 1940s, you know, cantors were in some ways represented by agents. They were trained by--a cantor became a cantor by studying privately with another cantor. There were no schools per se. And he made it a legitimate profession with an academic institution to train men for this position. And he established standards and qualifications, not only musical and Hazzanic, but religious standards.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2637.0,2685.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And he made it a clerical position--a clergy position. And that's all to his credit. That's all to his credit. He had a group of men around him that shared that vision. But the vision I think started with him.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: So you completed your degree at Julliard in 1975 and left Park Avenue Synagogue the same year?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2685.0,2711.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman:  Correct. I received a masters of music with a major in choral conducting in 1975 and decided that after six years as the Hazzan Sheni at the Park Avenue Synagogue was time for me to move on. I was 30--I was almost 30. 29, 30, something like that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: So can you walk us through that transition a little bit?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2711.0,2732.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes. I'm a senior in the--at the Julliard School, my senior--I'm in my last year in this master's program and a man from Minneapolis, whose name was Sy Hisandler [ph] came looking for me. I had met him on a trip to Israel and the position in Minneapolis, Adas Jeshurun as it was called, was open and he told the director of placement that he wanted what he called a David Tilman type. So the director of placement man, whose name was Paul Kavon [ph] said, well what about the real David Tilman.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2732.0,2777.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So the Cantor Kavon called me, it was in the fall of 1974, wanting to know, do I want to go to Minneapolis and interview for that congregation. So I thought, well, let me explore this. And so I went out there and had a wonderful experience, but I was single. I was single at the time and Minneapolis seemed very far away. And at the same--at a similar time Rabbi Landes, who was the senior rabbi here at Beth Shalom Congregation was looking for a cantor and he called Cantor Kavon and Cantor Kavon called me, \"well, now that you had the experience of the interview at Minneapolis, why don't you look at Philadelphia, at Beth Shalom in Elkins Park.\" So I said, okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2777.0,2833.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I came here in December of 1974, walked right up there to that bema and they interviewed--the committee asked me to sing a few things, which I did. Then I came back here in March of 1975 for another interview with a larger group of people and they offered me the position to be the Hazzan of Beth Shalom Congregation. They also offered me the position in Minneapolis, but I didn't take it because one, A, because I was single and that weighed on me. Two, I had been offered the position to become an adjunct instructor at the Jewish Theological Seminary teaching methods and materials of Jewish music.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2833.0,2883.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Education--Jewish music education by Dr. Tzipora Jochsberger, one of the great American Jewish educators. And she--I had studied with her and she saw something in me that she thought would be some--I would have something to offer the students at JTS in the area in which she had taught. And so, I wanted to do that. I really wanted to taste what it meant to be an academician at the Jewish Theological Seminary.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2883.0,2912.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And so coming here enabled me to take one of the great congregations in America that was at that time 1300 families here and go to New York one day a week, on Thursdays, which I did to teach this class in methods and materials of Jewish music education at the cantorial school. So I came here in the fall of 1975 and at the same time began teaching at JTS. And I continued to do that for...for eight...for nine years to 1984. To 1984.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: Was there a cantor here when you arrived?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2912.0,2948.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: No, he had left. I was replacing somebody. I was replacing someone and they had decided to--no, there was not a cantor, I was to...the senior cantor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: Who did you replace?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2948.0,2959.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: His name was Robert, I think Albert, A-l-b-e-r-t. Cantor Robert Albert. Was a tenor, nice man; nice man went somewhere else.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: I don't want to get too off-track. I do want to maybe ask you to--if you could talk just for a few minutes about some of the repertoire. What was the musical repertoire like in the synagogue in which you grew up with Avram Feder?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2959.0,2985.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, first of all, it was an a capella repertoire. That was a very right-wing congregation. There was no accompaniment at all. I remember becoming familiar with names like Lewandowski and Sulzer. I remember Cantor Feder who grew up in the lower east side, as I mentioned, had a whole range of melodies that he had learned from his father who was an orthodox Hazzan in the lower east side of Manhattan that were wonderful, charming melodies that he learned, that Cantor Feder learned, two part and three part arrangements to as a child in his father's synagogue. And from he--I remember that Cantor Feder told me he studied with Joshua Weisser, one of the early cantorial composers and interpreters of music and that was an influence on Cantor Feder and the music that he did.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=2985.0,3047.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e At the Park Avenue Synagogue, obviously, I was exposed to a vast amount of repertoire. There they had wonderful organists and fabulous quartets all the time. And Putterman had all this music that he had commissioned and all this other music that he taught me and exposed me to. Here, this congregation had--they had had in 1919, when the congregation was founded by Rabbi Mortimer J. Cohen, they--Rabbi Cohen's first hire was a music director whose name was Gedaliah Rubinowitz [ph]. Gedaliah Rubinowitz, who was European trained and was a good musician. And Rubinowitz wrote a lot of music, almost all of it for this place. Very little of it was published.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3047.0,3097.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Rubinowitz was replaced by Joseph Meyerhoff. He should live and be well, he's still alive in his early 90s, who is the organist choir master when I came here in 1975 and with whom I worked for the entire 36 years that I was here. Meyerhoff--Joe Meyerhoff wrote a lot of music, again, almost all of it for his place. Very little of it got published. So we would do a lot of Meyerhoff music. It was--I tried to introduce more contemporary music, I loved Yehezkel Braun. I loved Max Helfman. I began to implement music by those people here in this institution, all of which was not familiar to this community.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3097.0,3147.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e This community, Beth Shalom Congregation, particularly on the high holy days was not unlike other conservative congregations that didn't take change easily, particularly on Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, they wanted to feel like they were wearing bedroom slippers, musical and Hazzanic bedroom slippers. And that they were comfortable in those bedroom slippers. So change did not come quickly. I dabbled in a lot of music here. I remember doing this jazz service by Jose Bowen, which had a mixed reception here on a Friday night. But we did a much more diverse repertoire here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3147.0,3190.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJEFF JANECZKO:\u003c/strong\u003e So you had sort of walked us through coming to Beth Shalom...I was going to ask you maybe about some of those early experiments to change the musical culture.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3190.0,3203.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, all right. But we got to--we can do that but then we got to get to the choral thing, that's very...that's how I have defined myself in so many ways and I really--you know, I have a real rationale for that work and I want to describe how I implemented that in this place. And how, since I've left, because of--you know, I continue to do that work in different places.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3203.0,3227.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Jeff Janeczko: So however you want to get through that's...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDavid Tilman: Okay. I learned from all these experiences, some of which we've already discussed that the choral experience is a profoundly effective door to Jewish tradition. It's a profoundly effective way to teach Jewish values, Jewish beliefs, Jewish concepts, a sense of community, a sense of love of the Hebrew language, love of all Jewish languages to people with whom I interact.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3227.0,3265.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So, and that's based on those early experiences back with Cantor Feder in high school and the Temple Israel youth choir. It's based on my singing with the Columbia University Glee Club as an undergraduate at Columbia College and it's based on the six years I spent with Stanley Sperber at the beginning years of the summer chorale in New York. Very, very pivotal in my understanding of the impact of the choral experience on people. Not the audience but the participants, the participants.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3265.0,3302.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I understood from very early on and I made it my goal from very early on to use the choral experience to teach Jewish identity, to teach Jewish values, to teach a belief--to teach belief in almighty God, to teach a love of the state of Israel; to teach Jewish history, all of those things come from participation in a choral environment. And I again want to underline that means for the singers. If that impacts the congregants, the audience, that's great. But the prime goal of a choral experience in Jewish life and in synagogue life is for the people doing the singing, for the people doing the singing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3302.0,3353.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So I really did everything I could to create an expanded choral existence in this congregation. When I came to Beth Shalom Congregation, there was a professional quartet that sang from the choir loft back up there and they were in that style of--that was typical in the conservative movement where the choir was an ensemble of disembodied voices never to be seen but heard.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3353.0,3390.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And...and I saw that at the Park Avenue Synagogue and I saw that here. Here was very, very similar, but after I lived with it here for a while, I began to realize particularly on high holy days, where the compositions were somewhat extensive, that the congregants would be sitting in all of these seats would concentrate for maybe 50 seconds. And then a minute would go by and I see the eyes roll. I see the eyes roll. I see people lose their focus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3390.0,3421.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e My first thought was, well, the cantor, I was waiting too long to sing a solo, because the solo that I would be singing from the bima would bring their attention back to the experience. Then the choir would kick in again and they would lose their focus when they couldn't see who was singing. They lose their focus. So my initial attempts were, first of all, to take the quartet out of the choir loft and bring them out front. And that had mixed results. Some people liked that, some other people did not like that. Some of the singers, the professional singers, did not like being out in front of the people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3421.0,3468.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So simultaneously with that, was a move towards creating a volunteer ensemble of adults, a volunteer ensemble of adults. And without too much time going by, I had 25, 30, 35 men and women who would sing with me every Tuesday night from 8:00 to 10:00 pm. This choir would begin preparing Friday night repertoire. When that choir would sing in this room, they would sing from this section right here, these three or four rows right here out front.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3468.0,3509.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And we'd open the curtain over there, slide the curtain so the organist could see out and he'd see me if I was conducting this choir, or if someone else is conducting the choir, and the choir immediately became part and parcel of the life of the congregation, it was no longer a sense of disembodied sounds. The music that they sang was almost secondary to the fact that people had a visceral contact with the people; they could look at them. They could focus on the people doing the singing. They could watch the emotions being vented by the people doing the singing and they could identify with that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3509.0,3553.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And when it was a congregational melody that the choir would lead the people could invariably sing with them better when they were out front because of the--in Hebrew they'd say the ketsev, the rhythm of a professional ensemble of disembodied sounds singing from the choir loft, it was almost impossible for the congregation to stay with them; they would get ahead, they would get behind. When they were out front, those problems disappeared. And those issues of the role of the choir in the religious life of the congregation changed and dramatically for the better. Now, along with that came the opportunity to take that choir to various places within our own community here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3553.0,3602.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e My neighbor down the block, Cantor Charles Davidson, had a choir called it the AJ Choral Society and he and I began doing joint Hanukkah concerts where one year would be in our building, the next year we'd be at AJ and that became very popular in the community. The two--each choir would sing a set of pieces by themselves, then the choirs would get together. The choirs would get together and sing together. So two ensembles of 35 singers would become one wonderful ensemble of 70 singers. And that went on and went on and went on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3602.0,3636.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And then the next directive for me, to my own directive, was to start with children, because there was no--while there had been a choral history here of professional singers, there had been no choral experience with children at all. So again, after a not too long a period I was able to bring together 45, 50 elementary age children. Third grade to seventh grade. Soprano alto chorus. A lot of unison singing. Soprano one, soprano two, alto singing three part, up to three part. Children's voices. Once the children's voices changed they were no longer part of that ensemble. The children's choir, the Beth Shalom Youth Chorale as it became immediately became very popular all over town. And we started getting invited to the annual Israel day parade to sing Hatikvah. We started already in the mid-1980s. We sang at the academy of music with the Philly Pops Orchestra.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3636.0,3705.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And we gained this good reputation for these wonderful group of children. I took them to the Cantors Assembly Convention in the mid-1980s. Now, the children's choir would sing one Shabbat a month Saturday morning, again from these seats here. Over the years sometimes the seats on the other side as well. Oh in addition, depending on the sight lines to the organist or whatever. So, but they would sing out front.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3705.0,3736.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e The children's choir would sing once a month regularly and on Shabbat morning whenever a child in the children's choir had his or her bar mitzvah, or bat mitzvah, they would be the soloist for the various little tunes that we would do in the Musaf Kedusha. I did a lot of repertoire by my colleague Sol Zim, he should live and be well, who's been writing these, \"The Joy of Shabbat,\" \"The Joy of High Holy Days,\" \"The joy of the Festivals,\" these books that he's been writing are wonderful for an elementary age junior choir. My kids sang them with great gusto and great joy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3736.0,3777.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And as I said the children who's B'nai bar mitzvah we would celebrate on these given [Hebrew] would sing the solo line-- [sings] L'dor Vador, l'dor vador, L'dor Vador--would sing the solo line with the children's choir. And that proved to be a great vehicle to teach new congregational tunes to the congregation. From the children's choir, as the children graduated the children's choir in the seventh grade the next obvious step was the teenage choir.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3777.0,3808.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So we had a group called Ha Kolot Teenage Ensemble. Hakolot--the voices--Teenage Ensemble which we had some participation with what is now called the Hazamir, the Hazamir High School Choir. And we participated in that a number of years now, but not consistently, but we did that for a number of years. And the teenagers were terrific.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3808.0,3832.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e They were really--they could sing anything in high level music. And then the fourth and last chorus that we did here was a men's choir. Men's choir appealed to me on two levels. One it went back to my great love of tenor one, tenor two baritone one--bass one, bass two repertoire that I learned about singing in the Columbia University Glee Club. And I just had a visceral love for that close harmony that men can create when they sing together.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3832.0,3863.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And so we pulled together 15 men; 15, 16 men. And those 15, 16 men would sing on Shabbat mevorchim when we bless the new moon. Bless the new moon. And they would sing, you know, in different locations. Sometime the front row, sometimes--because that was around as you can see over my head there's that shulchan in the middle. So when I would bless the new moon [Hebrew], or lead the Musaf service, the men's choir would sing around me, around that table. And a lot of people love that sound. A lot of people really enjoyed the sound of the male choir. We began already back in 1978 doing one concert every other year with full orchestra. I commissioned a lot of arrangements of popular Hasidic tunes, popular Israeli tunes, as well as doing some of the wonderful classical pieces written by Jewish composers like Robert... \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: Can we get some examples?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3863.0,3929.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID TILMAN: Yes. Yes. I did--we did Robert Starer's Visions of Ariel, it's called. A-r-i-e-l \"Ariel: Visions of Isaiah.\" Wonderful piece. That Osbourne piece that I mentioned earlier, \"Souls on Fire.\" There's a baroque piece called \"Canticum Hebraicum\" by a non-Jewish French composer whose name was Ludovico Saladin, that he wrote for a brit milah, that's a wonderfully accessible piece. Very baroque. It's kind of minor league Bach, but it sounds great for harpsichord and strings and woodwinds and all that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3929.0,3969.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And we would do that, all of those things. And then the \"Chichester Psalms\" I must have done three, or four times here. Once with the full orchestrated version and two more, or two or three more times, with just the smaller version of that piece for organ, percussion, and one harp. And we do them all over here, we take out two rows of seats on the front of each section. And we could squeeze up to about 36, 38 players in this section. The choirs would sing from those first steps and the choir risers on the top. And that became really a major cultural event for the whole Delaware Valley. I'm very, very proud of that. Very proud of that. And that's going on, which we'll come to in a few minutes, yeah. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: Well, can you tell us about when you were doing this, I guess beginning in the '70s. You said every other year. Was there a particular time of year, or occasion?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=3969.0,4031.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Spring. Yeah, it's the time of year. The time of year was always in the spring for very obvious reasons. Amateur choirs need a whole year to prepare the music. So you need, you know, the fall and the spring to put the repertoire in place and really prepare it and really work it out. It also became, you know, an opportunity for Beth Shalom congregation...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4031.0,4052.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: The leadership was--this was an affluent community and leadership, many of them would go to Palm Beach or Boca Raton in the winter time. We always wanted those people to return in the early spring. So yeah, mid-May would become the time when we do these events. And we had various guest celebrities here. I had Alberto Mizrahi for one of these concerts; Cantor Sol Zim for one of these concerts. Shuli Natan--she's now an older woman, but she was the one who sang \"Yerushalayim Shel Zahav\" for the first time, in 1967. So she makes a wonderful presentation as a solo artist. So we had her twice. We had her twice in here singing as the guest soloist with this group of choruses that we would have in this room in this spot. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: So it sounds like music as a whole must be quite important to this congregation for...I mean these concerts sound quite elaborate you must...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4052.0,4123.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e They were. These concerts were elaborate. Required significant fundraising; it required, you know, printing elaborate programs with patrons, sponsors, donors to do those kinds of experiences. Now these events did not happen without--I don't want to say controversy, but they were never completely done in a...without...I mean in a peaceful situation. Any time a congregation, or non-profit organization is called upon to raise money there's always controversy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4123.0,4159.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e \"Do we have to do this?\" \"Do we have to do this on this level?\" \"Can we do it in a lesser level?\" And those are, you know, somewhat political issues that one has to see to it that you--that I had to engineer my way through that. Now having done that for any number of years it became after a certain point something that was going to be accepted. And something that was going to be understood. I think of all of those events a few of them stand out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4159.0,4197.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e In 2003, the congregation had commissioned the writing of a new Torah Scroll, a new sefer Torah scroll in honor to commemorate the retirement of the then-leaving ritual director. There was a very beloved ritual director here his name was Yaakov Lieberman. Who retired from here and moved to Modiin in Israel. And he was very beloved by the congregation. Very beloved. And so the congregation when--I viewed the writing of the Sacred Torah as a great way to honor Mr. Lieberman and a great way to fundraise.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4197.0,4241.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And they in fact raised close to $800,000 on writing this Torah scroll. And I then proposed that we do this piece of music called \"Souls on Fire\" by my beloved colleague Cantor Charles Osborne. \"Souls on Fire\" is a piece based on the book by Elie Wiesel of the same title. It has--there are nine movements as I recall.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4241.0,4269.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e There's an opening and an epilogue and then seven movements about the first generation of disciples of the Ba'al Shem Tov, Maggid of Mezeritch and all these different men of these great--of the first generation of Hasidic rebbes who came from the Ba'al Shem Tov. Wonderful piece. Long piece, 84 minutes long.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4269.0,4290.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I put together--that was one of my early attempts of putting together a community choir. Of taking my own Beth Shalom chorale and inviting synagogue choirs from up and down this Old York Road corridor to join in on that presentation. And then we brought in as the narrator in the pieces, a very elaborate narration, Leonard Nimoy, who had done the piece earlier.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4290.0,4316.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e He'd done the premiere recording of that piece and was the perfect person for this melodramatic narration that the piece called for. And so we approached him and he was willing to come and he came and the novelty of having Spock in this building was very wonderful. And he was utterly charming and we had a brunch for him at my home. The agent said, you know, don't pepper him with Star Trek questions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4316.0,4351.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So of course he begins by telling everybody about \"live long and prosper\" and being the shin from the kokhanim and then he begins the following way. He said, \"you know, I grew up in Boston and it was a very anti-Semitic neighborhood. And as a teenager I became very alienated, so I moved to Los Angeles and I became an alien.\" That's how he began. But when it comes to the piece, he was a total pro. And he read the narration with such elegance and such poetry.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4351.0,4383.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And he stood right over there, at the rabbi's podium and did this narration for all the movements. And the narration was complicated because it moved in and out of the music. And he had to wait for--I had some inhibitions about giving Leonard Nimoy a cue. He said, \"no, no by all means you can tell me when. Or you can nod at me; I'll know when to come in.\" But the little muse and tell was, he finishes the event.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4383.0,4412.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e He left with the agent to drive back to Manhattan. His wife calls him on the car phone and says, \"Leonard how was the concert?\" And he said, \"oh, it was wonderful. Hazzan Tilman was very much in command, the piece was great. But I felt somewhat secure because hanging over my head was a Klingon Bird of Prey\"; meaning that, the chandelier, Frank Lloyd Wright's chandelier which is up there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4412.0,4441.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I can't look at it now to this day without thinking of Star Trek, as a Klingon Bird of Prey. But we had him, we had Theodore Bikel here. We did a piece called \"Dori,\" D-o-r-i, written by a classmate of mine at Juilliard and a wonderful composer, his name is Elliot Weiss, who has written much music for the Park Avenue Synagogue, so written music for KJ, Kehilath Jeshurun which is an orthodox synagogue on the east side of Manhattan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4441.0,4470.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And Elliot wrote this piece called \"Dori,\" D-o-r-i, based on the last 10 years in the life of Theodor Herzl. His original concept was for it to be a Broadway show. But he then changed it to a cantata, to a non-staged piece about this last 10 years in the life of Herzl, ending with Herzl's death at age 44. He co-wrote that with Eric Blau--who wrote \"Jacques Brel Is Alive and Well,\" very wonderful librettist and the piece is great. We did that piece.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4470.0,4503.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e We sold so many tickets for that that we had to move it to KI, which had their sanctuary there. You could fit 1,400 seats in there. So we moved it up there and Theodore Bikel, we brought him in to narrate that piece. And that was a major, big success here. Major success for us. We did a concert called--we did a concert with a group called Work of the Weavers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4503.0,4531.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Work of the Weavers is a tribute ensemble to the original Weavers of Pete Seeger and -- and Fred Hellerman and that group, Lee Hays and Ronnie Gilbert. So this Work of the Weavers does a spot-on job of singing music by the Weavers, of which there are pieces of Jewish content the Weavers sang, Tzena, Tzena, Shalom Aleichem, Hine Ma Tov, and a whole bunch of Jewish pieces that we would sing. We replicated all of that right here in this room with the Work of the Weavers. So we did that. So we had a wonderful experience.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4531.0,4566.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I began in the beginning of the century in the 2000s as the Elkins Park, Abington, and Old York Road community was beginning to contract, so I did more and more by pulling together the various choirs of the synagogues up and down Old York Road. And those particular concerts, many of them we did not just with the Beth Shalom people but with AJ, KI, and Knesset-Israel and Bet Yam, Old York Temple Bet Yam, and pulled all those forces together to do those kinds of wonderful moments that  affected lives.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4566.0,4603.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e That touched lives; that changed lives Jewishly. Not only for themselves, for the people themselves...what the other things...the other element of that experience that I began to witness myself was the experience of intergenerational singing. We would always end these concerts with the children's choir and the teenage choirs singing together with the adult choir. So I would have experienced situations of grandchildren in the front row on the step.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4603.0,4636.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And then in the adult choir would be their parents and even their grandparents singing together the music of the Jewish people. And that was just a wonderful divine moment that touched me. That touched me and I was the facilitator. And I was moved by it, I was moved by it with my own children when all three of my children would sing in this ensemble. When I retired here in 2011, we had this glorious evening called \"Hazzan Tilman and Friends.\" And one of the parents in Beth Shalom Congregation took it upon herself to gather together alumni from the Beth Shalom youth chorale.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4636.0,4721.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And so I had 45 alumni come back to sing that concert. And I did with the current youth chorale some of the pieces I had done many, many years earlier and I had the soloist of...our current soloist, and soloist with college. And the soloist who was 40 years old and a mother of three children who had sang the same solo when they were 10 and 11 years old. A very, very powerful moment. L'dor vador from one generation to another. It was a...and that's all inherent in the music of the Jewish people as a vehicle to implement all of those experiences. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: Can you tell us about the repertoire of Shabbat and services at Beth Shalom during your time here in terms of like what was the--maybe some of the sort of aesthetic choices, of, you know maybe what a normal Shabbat might be if there is such a thing. And then what were the kind of range of options that you worked on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4721.0,4741.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e The repertoire at Beth Shalom over my 36 years changed--had to change. It had to change. When I came here in 1975 it was a heavy dose, particularly Friday night. The Friday night repertoire was a heavy dose of the current at that time organist Joe Miroff who was a composer and wrote very melodious, but very, you know, old style music for cantor and choir.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4741.0,4770.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Together with Lewandowski, together with Sulzer, together with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4770.0,4809.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And as I mentioned earlier, you know, I was taken by these easy refrains of Sol Zim, the Sol Zim refrains, which became part and parcel of the congregational repertoire. There were, as all of my colleagues do, adaptations of Israeli melodies in parts of the Kedushah that became de rigeur to the point where people didn't recognize where they came from. And everybody sings erev shel shoshanim tu mimkom hu yifen b’rakhamim in the Musaf Kedusha and people forget that that was originally an Israeli tune and it becomes the way you sing mimkom hu yifen b’rakhamim.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4809.0,4855.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So it was a diversified experience. It was a--again, this congregation had a kind of a schizophrenic almost approach to instruments. They had a long-term relationship with the pipe organ but they had...they were adverse to other instruments. And there was a growing group of right-wingers, not politically, but musically, that didn't like the organ at all. And so there was a greater...there was an emphasis to try a cappella services more and more and more.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4855.0,4893.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And in fact that's what happens now. That's what happens now. Nine--approaching nine years since I've left here, there's almost no instrumental music in this community at all. A little bit on Friday night once a month, other than that it's totally an a cappella experience. I hope that answers your question. I wish I can be more specific, but that was the environment of the congregation.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: Has there been any new music created specifically for the synagogue since you've--because there seems to be a tradition of that. Have you carried on the tradition of creating new music for the synagogue?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4893.0,4930.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Here? Yes. Yes. Yes. I definitely...Again, Joe Miroff, who was the long-term choir director, I would ask him to write me--look, you know, someone died may he rest in peace. Joe, write a new setting of a Friday night kiddush.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4930.0,4949.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Or pick a Friday night service to memorialize the former member of the choir who died. So he would do that. He would be the kind of the fail-safe person to go to that. I did commission Benjie Ellen Schiller to write a Shabbat morning Musaf Kedusha for my youth chorale. For my youth chorale to give them some alternatives to do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4949.0,4976.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: So she--you know I did ask her to write that. I did do a number of commissions of arrangements...for these big orchestral concerts that I did. If we had an Israeli tune or a neo-Hasidic tune. So I did acquire phone numbers and contacts of wonderful arrangers, wonderful arrangers who wrote wonderful choral and/or orchestral arrangements of these pieces that I still have that exist in my own library, that we premiered right here in this room and that electrified the congregation. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: Have you composed anything yourself?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=4976.0,5023.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman:  No. No. No. I've never had that...muse to be a composer. In school I was required to, you know to write a melody, but I've never been a...that...has not settled on me, the ability to sit down and come up with a memorable phrase that would be memorable musically. I'm a collector, a compiler, a facilitator, an educator. Conductor. That's what...all those words are inherent in the word conductor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: Is there...before we go on, is there anything else you want to tell us about the Beth Shalom congregation experience?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5023.0,5062.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I had...At Beth Shalom congregation I had 36 event-filled and meaningful years that proved all of these thoughts that I had about ways to touch Jewish souls. Now in that experience obviously there were other things that happened. So I had it--we were the first...I was the first cantor in the community to teach children to daven the Shacharit service.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5062.0,5098.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e To lead the Shacharit, the morning service. That was--my cantorial colleagues did not do that. They felt they were somehow losing some of their own prerogative. But I felt that's what moved me when I was a child. My cantor taught me to lead the service. I felt that the only thing I can do in return is to enable children to lead services. So I'm very, very proud of that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5098.0,5121.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Very proud of teaching adults. There's a group of men in this congregation to this day who lead Shacharit on Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur and I trained them to do that. I opened up the mysteriousness of the High Holy Day experience to a group of laymen. I felt very good about that. I had a program that I called the Torah Club, that taught Torah reading to hundreds and hundreds of boys and girls and adults.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5121.0,5149.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: We had a group of adult bat mitzvah programs that went on for about 10 years where women who had never had a bat mitzvah learned how to chant haftarah; learned how to read Torah. To this day some of the graduates of those programs are amongst the best volunteer Torah readers that this congregation experienced--has. And I'm very proud to have been the facilitator to have made that happen. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: Have you received any recognition for the music that you have...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5149.0,5180.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e The congregation has received a lot of recognition. In the days when the United Synagogue was a more active umbrella organization in the conservative movement than it is right now, they used to give out what they called the Solomon Schechter prize in any number of categories. So we won the Solomon Schechter prize in Jewish music and synagogue skills four times. 1979, early 1980s once, twice in the 1990s we won that prize. They would give out that prize in categories depending on the size of the congregation. So we won that four times. I personally received two honorary doctorates. I have an honorary doctorate from the cantorial school of JTS.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5180.0,5229.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I have an honorary doctorate from Gratz College down the block here that I received recently in 2016 in recognition of all this great work that happened in this institution. And the Cantors Assembly also gave me two of their awards. In 2001 already they gave me what they call the Moshe Nathanson Prize for a lifetime achievement in conducting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5229.0,5262.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I was the first person to win that award. They give that award every other year. They also--the year I retired in 2011, they gave me the Samuel Rosenbaum Award for lifetime achievement. And then that same year, 2011, the Educators Assembly, which is the organization of Jewish educators within the conservative movement, gave me what they call their “Or Zaruah” prize for planting seeds in the minds of Jewish children.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5262.0,5293.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: But they give that award every year. It was the first time they'd ever given it to a hazzan, and they gave it to me. Gave it to me. I felt very fulfilled about that. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: You want to tell us what you've been doing for the last few years?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5293.0,5309.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I'd be honored to. So for the last few years when I stepped down here in 2011, I was approached by the neighboring congregation, a reform congregation up the block, well literally one block up north, the reform congregation Knesset Israel. Their cantor there is Amy Levy, wonderful young woman with great vision. And she invited me to come in there to take over their adult choir, which had been in a period of decline. And so after some deliberate thought, it was not a simple decision to make. But after some deliberate thought I decided to accept that position. I had a relationship with some of those singers who had sung with me here in these community events.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5309.0,5358.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I decided to accept her offer. I was told by the president of the congregation, who had been a young man who I trained for his bar mitzvah here, and was now the president at KI up the block. And he said to me, \"Hazzan Tilman, we at KI take our music with great seriousness.\" I said \"well I'm thrilled, I'm thrilled that you're coming to me to do that.\" So I had to learn what happens in a reform synagogue.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5358.0,5386.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I am a lifelong, loyal member of the conservative community. Conservative with a capital C. I grew up in a conservative congregation, as I've told you, this--I believe in it. I believe in the conservative movement as a valid approach to Jewish tradition and I'm not going to change that by me going to a reform congregation. And I made that very clear to the people with KI. But, you know I've learned their ritual there, particularly High Holy Days, which is an incredibly rich musical tradition. We have there these 30 volunteers, they bring in seven pros, seven vocal pros and a virtuoso organist that...the music there is incredibly diverse. Incredibly rich. The classics, music by Jonathan Comisar, music by Israelis--Israeli music. We've done that incredible Unetanah Tokef, written by...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5386.0,5452.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e [inaudible]. Exactly. We do that up there with drum set and kick and piano keyboard. Yeah, you know, I mean just as diverse as it could be and that congregation with that choir, we do an annual major musical event. We did a musical event a few years ago. They have these incredible stained glass windows at KI. And so we did a whole program about the biblical characters in each one of those windows.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5452.0,5482.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e We did the first--I should go on about this at some length--the first event in the Leonard Bernstein centennial. We did a Leonard Bernstein centennial program at KI featuring Candide and West Side Story and the full performance at the Chichester Psalms. And we did...the congregation, they celebrated their 170th year.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5482.0,5509.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And they commissioned Jonathan Comisar to set to music the letter that George Washington wrote to the reform congregation in Providence, Rhode Island, \"to bigotry no sanction.\" And Jonathan wrote this magnificent piece that we premiered up there for instrumental ensemble. The piece runs about 13 minutes. And so we did that up there. And the last thing which I will share with you, and we can sum up or we can go on other conversations, is that I now do a series at Verizon Hall.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5509.0,5550.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Which is the major concert venue in the Delaware Valley. I was approached--well, actually, I went to him first--the senior executive producer down there, a man--his name was Jay Wahl W-a-h-l. And we present now an annual concert of Jewish music for combined choirs. We have literally 160, 170 singers and cantorial soloists. We do a concert of serious and not-too-serious and popular Jewish music in the stage of Verizon Hall.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5550.0,5583.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I've done two of them and I'm now working on a third one. The first one featured music for the organ and large choir and cantorial solos featuring a magnificent organ in that building. So the organ foundation underwrote that concert. Last year we did a series of pieces by...mostly by Americans--either pieces by American composers or pieces by other composers who were commissioned by American institutions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5583.0,5616.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And we had the great Alberto Mizrahi as our cantorial solo. And for our third one, which will be March 17, 2020, I'm doing a program on music written by Jews for the stage. For the stage beginning with Yiddish Theater coming all the way to the present-day Jewish composers who have written for the Broadway stage and other stages. So that's...we are going to do that this coming March.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5616.0,5642.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e It's like my--literally my fourth, my fourth career and it's like a full time job from beginning of September through mid-March. But again I come back to the power of this choral experience to teach Jewish identity and Jewish values to the singers first, to the congregants, to the audience second, and to elevate souls, change souls. And I do feel unbelievably fulfilled at having implemented all of that and seen to it that these people have these experiences that last-- stay with them all their lives.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5642.0,5685.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I did in anticipation of our...this wonderful session today, I did read through letters that I received when I left here, left Beth Shalom in June of 2011. And I read through some very powerful letters that I received; one from a young woman who is a Jewish educator and now a lawyer. And she writes to me. She wrote--she's now in her mid-40s and she wrote to me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5685.0,5710.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: She wrote to me about how when her children were born she sang to them all the songs that she learned from me, that she learned from her experience in the Beth Shalom youth chorale. And how all of these musical events made her the committed serious Jew she is, for herself, for her husband, and for her children. And those experiences have repeated themselves with me time and time again.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: That's wonderful. I'm going to the Kimmel Hall--the Verizon Hall, Kimmel concert series. Could you maybe talk about...I'm curious about two things, one is maybe just flush out what the kind of like goals were for maybe the first or second concert. And the second would be it's a rather unusual thing for a community to do a concert in a major venue like this on this scale. And you know, what is it about, you know, this community or this context that makes that possible?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5710.0,5772.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, that's a great question. We want to discuss now how this Verizon Hall concert came to be...and how it has sustained itself amongst the Jewish community. So four years ago, four years ago maybe--yeah four years ago. The organist with whom I work at KI who's a virtuoso organist, good guy, wonderful guy and a fabulous player.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5772.0,5805.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So he was approached to put together an event that had been--I think had been an annual event of combining four or five church choirs to present serious music from the church repertoire on the stage of Verizon Hall with this Cooper organ. So he did that rather efficiently and was able to call his organist colleagues together to pull together their choirs and do a serious program.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5805.0,5840.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e He came to me saying that I should suggest one piece of Jewish content which I did. I suggested that he look at the Helfman \"Hashkiveinu\" as a piece that would be great for a cantorial soloist and wonderful choral writing and wonderful writing for the organ. So he did that. I went to the concert at Verizon Hall and I sat there saying to myself that we Jews, we Jewish musicians roughly speaking have maybe 180 or 190 years of music for organ, cantor, and choir.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5840.0,5875.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e A colleague--our colleague Cantor Joe Levine told me many years ago that 1810 is considered the year that the first organ was played in a Jewish worship, somewhere in Germany. So now the organ in Jewish worship even in the reform movement now is on the ebb and everybody has bands, rock bands. Rock bands or whatever they have, less of them--not the organ.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5875.0,5902.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e But so if you go from 1810 to 2000, let's say, so you have 190 years of music written for the organ and for the synagogue, synagogue ritual. So I said to myself sitting there in Verizon Hall that this event deserves Jewish programming. So I said to Andrew, my organist at KI, I said, set up an appointment with me for the--with this producer, with Jay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5902.0,5935.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e So Amy Levy from KI, she and I went down to meet Jay Wahl. Turned out to have been--grew up in a reform synagogue in Florida. So he knew about Debbie Friedman and he knew about Craig Taubman. And had a Jewish background in reform synagogue. So I said to him, Jay, I said \"Jewish people, this is the fourth largest Jewish community in the United States. We have this wonderful music that deserves to be on your stage.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5935.0,5965.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e His title is senior producing director of kimmelcenter.org. So he's the number one guy down there. And he said, \"write me a program.\" So I took a couple months and I drafted him a program in two parts, 19th century work, Jewish music, Lewandowski, Sulzer, Naumbourg; 20th century Jewish music, Kurt Weill, Max Helfman, Yehezkel Braun, and Leonard Bernstein, the Chichester Psalms written for organ.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5965.0,5997.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I presented it to him. So he said to me, \"well, do you want to do this?\" I said \"you give me the go-ahead and I'll implement this for you, I'll put this in place for you.\" So I then went ahead. He gave me a budget; I went ahead and talked to my conductor friends, the Jewish conductors I know. And everybody--not everybody, but six choirs bought into the idea and agreed to prepare this repertoire with their singers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=5997.0,6025.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e In turn I offered each one of these conductors the opportunity to conduct one piece on the Verizon Hall stage and that was appealing for them and for their choirs. And that's how it came to be. That's how it came to be. The first event drew about 1400 people. And then there was the second event that drew a similar amount, about 1400 or 1500 people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6025.0,6050.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And he wanted a headliner, Jay did, and so I approached Alberto Mizrahi, with whom I have a 50-year relationship and it was just incredibly successful. And the music was done with great flair, I feel. And it was very thrilling to hear Lewandowski \"Hallelujah\" on that stage with that organ. It was quite the moment, no question. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: So before we wrap up...I mean a couple of questions that I'm sure you've thought a lot about and something that we're engaged in is, where do you think American Jewish music is headed? And maybe before you think about that answer, perhaps you could just tell it from your perspective, what do you think of the significant developments in the last 20, 25 years of American Jewish music?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6050.0,6109.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Neil Levin, a name that...you know well from the Milken tradition. So he said to me a long time ago--or maybe I read it, I don't remember if he said it to me privately or I read it. But he made this opening concept. He said opening--a broad statement, he said that historically Jewish music at a certain point begins to sound like the music of the host environment.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6109.0,6136.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And I think we're living through that time right now. We're living through a time, and it's not new, it's not new, but we're living through a time where people who are creating Jewish music are creating American Jewish music. And both American serious Jewish music and American pop Jewish music. All of which is good. All of which is good. My singular criteria--criterion...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6136.0,6166.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e My singular criterion for whether a piece is meaningful is does it bring the text to life. Bring the text to life. And if a person...if a person writes folk music, writes rock music, writes Chassidic music that somehow brings to life the text which it's set, that's just great. That's wonderful. So we're living...a more direct answer to your question, we're living in a time of Jewish music sounding more and more like Jews of America.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6166.0,6207.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Jews of America. And that's all to the good as long as we may remember me’ayin bata. As long as we remember from whence we have cometh. Innovation is great as long as we know how it's developed. I think that it not a particularly rosy time for the long term future although it may change. I think that there's an element particularly in the movement that I know best which is the conservative movement, an element of some anxiety.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6207.0,6245.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Because the movement is diminishing in numbers and the rabbinic leadership and maybe even the lay leadership grab at straws in an attempt to figure out a solution to how do we keep the people here? And I think that they may grab at a straw of making things so simple and so elementary that it loses its dignity and loses its soulfulness, its soulfulness, when everything becomes light and pop.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6245.0,6291.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I love chocolate ice cream, but I can't eat a whole meal of chocolate ice cream unless I've had some protein first. And I think that that--that's a lesson that the rabbinic community has not learned well. I think, again in the conservative movement that, you know, that there are congregations that are eliminating the cantorial position. And they say they're doing that for financial reasons but it's more than that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6291.0,6325.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I think they're so desperate to create music or have a musical environment that they perceive--the leadership of the synagogues--perceive will be received by their congregants with open arms that they feel that maybe lay people can do that better than cantors can do. I think that's a very short-sighted decision. But that--we have to, somehow, have to educate both the lay leadership and the rabbinic community that there is certainly an incredibly valid and important role for the cantorate--for the organized cantorate to enrich and sustain the community in a serious musical way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6325.0,6371.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Serious does not mean heavy. You know, serious means commitment. Serious means intensity. You can have commitment and intensity to pop music. I always used to tell people that, you know, when people would talk to me about \"Hazzan, we have to--the people have to participate more!\" And I would--my answer to that is participation does not necessarily mean loud singing. Participate --the opposite of participation is indifference. The opposite of participation is not silence.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6371.0,6404.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e You can participate and be silent. When you're not participating at all that's indifferent. So you can be serious about pop music. You can be serious about intensely complicated music. But the idea is to create a sense of commitment and a sense of seriousness and a sense of passion to whatever music one is doing. And it behooves my colleagues in the next generations to be able to do that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6404.0,6430.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And I went this year for the first time in a few years to the Cantors Assembly. Well, we saw each other at the Cantor Assembly convention in Louisville. And I saw a lovely group of young men and women who are committed, who are passionate Jews. Who daven themselves and pray themselves, and are committed to Jewish law, who seem to be very committed and very, very directed to making Jewish music part and parcel of their work for the succeeding generations. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: I wanted to ask you, you mentioned at the beginning of the interview, we started talking about Rabbi-Cantor Feder and how he set...was a big influence on you and set this example but that it took you a long--you said it took you a long time to come back toward that example. Could you just maybe kind of close the circle for us on that--how that...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6430.0,6482.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/170","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, if I say a long time it means...I entered college at age 18, we all are when we enter college. And I was on my way to a career in engineering. And to build rockets and missiles. I never thought about the Cantorate seriously because I didn't think that I was qualified enough.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6482.0,6507.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/171","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e I didn't think I was talented enough. I didn't...I just had all this self-doubt that I could do it effectively. And then the experiences I had in college and at Camp Ramah and in the Hazamir chorale broadened my sense of what and how a cantor can function. And that enabled me to come to grips with making that circle back to where Cantor Feder had launched me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6507.0,6546.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/172","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e But it was not, you know, it's just not a direct path. It was not this, it was this. But I came back there up there rather than from here to there. And it's interesting that you--if I have been able to convey to you this man's impact on me I'm very happy. I spoke to him two days before he died in January of 2018.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6546.0,6578.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/173","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: And of the many goals that I had in my life, one was to make him proud of me; to give him a sense that I had taken what he had given me--the Jewish identity he had given me and that I've been able to implement that with many, many other people. And I know that I did that with him. I know that I did that with him. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: Any final thoughts of yours?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJeff Janeczko: Anything you'd like to add at all?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6578.0,6611.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/174","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"David Tilman: Mark, you and I met each other at the Brandeis-Bardin Institute.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eMark Kligman: Many years ago.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDavid Tilman: Many years ago. And I was invited to come to Brandeis-Bardin in 1976. And I got out there. And I found an environment that took Jewish music and community singing with utmost seriousness. And there was a time--and then I spent nine summers there--nine summers--teaching Israeli and American Jewish popular music to anywhere between 50 and 75 college kids, college age kids.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6611.0,6656.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974/transcript/45010/annotation/175","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID TILMAN:\u003c/strong\u003e And that was again another environment where I saw the power of the Jewish musical experience to touch neshamot, to touch the souls of the people doing the singing. So those nine summers at Brandeis-Bardin were a very important part of the skill set that I accrued to myself. I feel very accomplished and very fulfilled. I feel that the Jewish musical endeavor has enabled me to make an impact on a succeeding generation of Americans Jews. And I don't know if I could have done that any other way than through this, the vehicle of the Jewish musical experience. In anticipation of our meeting today I read through a number of letters and documents that people wrote me when I left Beth Shalom Congregation. And those feelings were confirmed for me. You know, I really feel that I've had an impact on people's lives. And that I've been able to use these Jewish musical tools to ensure not only a future of Jewish music but a future of Jews. A future of Jews. That the music of our people has given me the ingredients to do my part to ensure a future for the Jewish community at large.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/91770/file/187974#t=6656.0,6776.60444"}]}]}]}