{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/k06ww77k78/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Amram, David"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/115/original/Boxed_Milken_Center_logo.png?1628711583","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Preferred Citation"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eAmram, David. 1998. Interview by Neil W. Levin and Barry Serota. Milken Archive Oral History Project. 22 October.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publisher"]},"value":{"en":["Milken Family Foundation"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003e© Milken Family Foundation. Unauthorized use is prohibited. For inquiries, please contact info@milkenarchive.org.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Amram, David (Composer)","Levin, Neil W. (Interviewer)","Serota, Barry (Interviewer)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["1998-10-22"]}},{"label":{"en":["Coverage"]},"value":{"en":["Ellis Island, NY (Place of Recording)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":["English (Primary)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eOral history interview with David Amram focused on several of his major Jewish related works, including Let Us Remember (for chorus and orchestra; 1965), Songs of the Soul (orchestral piece; 1986), Shir l’erev Shabbat (sacred service; 1960), and The Final Ingredient (opera; 1965). Also encompasses Amram's reflections regarding his upbringing in rural Pennsylvania, his connections with jazz and the African American musical community, media and technology, musical modernism, and his engagment with traditional Jewish music.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u003ca href=\"https://www.milkenarchive.org/artists/view/david-amram\"\u003eView Artist Page from the Milken Archive\u003c/a\u003e\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["Beta SP"]}},{"label":{"en":["Subject"]},"value":{"en":["Jews -- Music (Topical Term)","Jazz (Topical Term)","African Americans -- Relations with Jews (Topical Term)","Oral Histories (genre/form)","American Broadcasting Company (Person Or Corporate Body)","Hughes, Langston, 1902-1967 (Person Or Corporate Body)","Park Avenue Synagogue (Person Or Corporate Body)","Putterman, David (Person Or Corporate Body)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Keyword"]},"value":{"en":["American Broadcasting Company, Arnold Weinstein, Avram Pengas, Bruce Prince-Joseph, cantor, David Putterman, ecumenicism, Edward G. Robinson (1893-1973), farm life, Gerhardt Samuels, George Irving Shirley, improvisation, jazz, Joseph Papp, Langston Hughes, Let Us Remember, Maurice Peress, Oakland Symphony Orchestra, Ode to Lord Buckley, opera, Park Avenue Synagogue, Passover, Pennsylvania -- Feasterville, Reginald Rose, sabbath, sacred music, Sephardi Jews, Seth McCoy, Shakespeare in the Park, Songs of the Soul, Shir l'erev Shabbat, synagogue, The Final Ingredient, Thomas Pyle (Baritone), transliteration, Union of American Hebrew Congregations, United Suffolk Wives of Long Island, Yossele Rosenblatt, Zionism"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eOral history interview with David Amram focused on several of his major Jewish related works, including Let Us Remember (for chorus and orchestra; 1965), Songs of the Soul (orchestral piece; 1986), Shir l\u0026rsquo;erev Shabbat (sacred service; 1960), and The Final Ingredient (opera; 1965). Also encompasses Amram's reflections regarding his upbringing in rural Pennsylvania, his connections with jazz and the African American musical community, media and technology, musical modernism, and his engagment with traditional Jewish music.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u003ca href=\"https://www.milkenarchive.org/artists/view/david-amram\"\u003eView Artist Page from the Milken Archive\u003c/a\u003e\u003c/p\u003e"]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003e\u0026copy; Milken Family Foundation. Unauthorized use is prohibited. For inquiries, please contact info@milkenarchive.org.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Lowell Milken Center for Music of American Jewish Experience"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Lowell Milken Center for Music of American Jewish Experience"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/115/original/Boxed_Milken_Center_logo.png?1628711583","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/110/800/small/David-Amram.jpg?1618940642","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - L1867_MA_Composer_Interview_Amram_1_Fixed.mp4"]},"duration":2174.016,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/110/800/small/David-Amram.jpg?1618940642","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-milken.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/110/800/original/L1867_MA_Composer_Interview_Amram_1_Fixed.mp4?1616171759","type":"Video","format":"video/mp4","duration":2174.016,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["Edited Transcript 12.2.21 [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eBARRY SEROTA:\u003c/strong\u003e Where were you born, where did you grow up, and what kind of education did you have?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=18.0,21.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh.  I was born at the Langan Hospital in Philadelphia on November 17th, 1930.  I was brought up on a farm in Feasterville, Pennsylvania, which, at that time, was a very rural, southern part of Bucks County.  And there’s an old aerial photograph where you’ll see nothing but farms, including our farm.  Now, it’s completely shopping malls and cemented over. And my father had the dream that my grandfather did.  My grandfather, David Warner, whom I was named after, was an early Zionist.  And his second wife, in fact, had spent a great many years in what we now call Israel.  Well, it was at that time called Palestine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=21.0,74.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And they both had the idea of living in a very old-fashioned way, and possibly living on a kibbutz.  So, since there was no such thing in the United States, my father went to Penn State and got a degree in agriculture, after he had served in World War I in the Army, and became a farmer, full-time, for four years, with his brother, whom I was named after — David Amram.  And we were brought up on that farm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=74.0,108.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But by the end of the ‘20s, it was already economically impossible for small farmers to really survive in that part of the country, even then.  The, the doom for the American farmer had begun.  So, he went to law school at an older age than most people did, and graduated at the top of his class; continued farming, and was an instructor at the University of Pennsylvania Law and has a law book out called Pennsylvania Procedure, which is a textbook that’s still used.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=108.0,139.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And his father wrote a book called Leading Cases In the Bible, that took famous Bible stories and updated them as if they were told by a legal scholar today, and showed the legal ramifications of all of those old, great stories that we grew up studying and learning as children.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=139.0,164.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, even though I lived in a place where there was almost no Jewish population, in Feasterville, Pennsylvania, I had all that at home.  From my grandfather, who started to teach me Hebrew when I was six, and my father, who conducted Friday night services at our farmhouse — did all the bruchas himself and taught all of us about that.  He even had a little Sunday school for my sister and myself and some of our relatives, and would try to instruct us.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=164.0,191.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Because he saw, as well as his brother, who became a merchant seaman and traveled around the world, that the Jewish heritage in the ‘30s and ‘40s was in jeopardy, to an extent.  It was in a state of peril, because the more we became Americanized, the further many of us retreated from our Jewish roots, and from all of our roots. And it was explained to me as a kid, this was not only Jewish people, but all people who have a cultural tie to the past that doesn’t necessarily have any economic value.  And that therefore, it was very important to, always to retain what we were born with.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=191.0,238.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And that mitzvah — that gift — from birth, was free.  But because it was free, it wasn’t worthless.  It was priceless. And he also felt that way about Jewish music.  And I used to hear recordings of Yossele Rosenblatt and the great cantors.  My father would sit and play Brahms and Beethoven. And my uncle would play Louis Armstrong and Duke Ellington, who he took me to hear, as a ten-year-old boy.  And explained the relationship of those beautiful musics that, in the new world, were coming from the genius of the African-American culture, were tied emotionally to our cantorial music and our klezmer music and our traditional musics that came from the heart, that came from an oral tradition, that came from an ability to improvise, and to always tell a story.  And how the most important thing, in music and in life, whatever status you achieved, was to be a real mensch — as they say in Hebrew, hadavar ha’achee chashuv ba’cha’im ze lechi’ot ben adam.  The most important thing in life is to be a real mensch.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=238.0,310.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And when I was in Israel a few years ago, I said, “How can you say that in Hebrew?” They said, “Well, there’s no such thing as the word ‘mensch’ anymore — that’s a colonial term.  And speaking ivreit, we tried to bring back the universal language of Hebrew.  And therefore, Yiddish is becoming popular again.  But in terms of the word mensch, it’s so important, we’re going to figure out how to say that.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=310.0,338.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"NEIL LEVIN:  Were you commissioned by Park Avenue Synagogue at one time?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=338.0,341.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e I wrote a sacred service in 1960, Shir l’erev Shabbat — On the Eve of — the Sabbath Eve. And, Cantor David Putterman had met me one evening, Shakespeare in the Park, where I was commissioned — although Joseph Papp didn’t really have any money to commission me — but he allowed me, thank heavens, with no funds, to write the music for the very first Shakespeare in the Park there ever was, in the summer of 1957, with Jerry Stiller and Anne Meara, and, later on, George C. Scott, and all these great actors.  And it was really exciting.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eAnd the following summer, we did Twelfth Night, which I eventually made into an opera with Joseph Papp — a two-act opera.  But of course, at that time, I was writing incidental music.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=341.0,393.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And Cantor Putterman came with his son, Zev Putterman, because Zev knew me, because of — Zev Putterman, the cantor’s son.  Zev was a friend of Lenny Bruce.  And I knew Lenny Bruce from my involvement as a jazz musician.  I was playing with Oscar Pettiford’s band, with Charles Mingus and Dizzy Gillespie.  And I had met Lenny Bruce, and met Zev Putterman through that circle of friends. So, Zev brought his father, Cantor David J. Putterman, to the Shakespeare in the Park to meet me.  And apparently, Cantor Putterman liked my music.  And he said, “David,” he said, “you’re a promising composer.  Someday, I want you to write a piece for our synagogue.” And I said, “Well, I would be thrilled.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=393.0,441.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e So, sure enough, about a year later, he asked me if I would write a Friday night service. And I spent probably nearly 200 hours with him.  Because of my dad’s side being Sephardic, my transliteration for the singers, who were mostly English-speaking singers and had to read a transliteration, would never have been accurate in the Ashkenazic pronunciation.  And Cantor Putterman, in addition to being such a wonderful, expressive singer, and knowing the traditional singing — when he sung the counting of the omar and those traditional things, it was just phenomenal.  And while he said, “I’m not really schooled in, in music the way Jan Peerce and some of the great opera singers are,” he said, “I have the nishoma, I have the soul.”  And he said, “I can show you the pronunciation, the style, and the transliteration.  And we’re going to go over every single syllable, so that when it’s done in the future, it will be accurate and set well.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=441.0,507.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And he said, “Now imagine if Handel’s Messiah had had some help when he was writing some of the English — (sings) For the Lord God om-nee-po-tent — instead of “omnipotent.” Because Handel, not knowing English that well, wrote one of the greatest pieces of all time, in spite of the fact that it wasn’t really set as well as it would have been if he’d either written it in German or had someone like Cantor Putterman come and say, “Look.  You’re a genius, but that ain’t the way it’s pronounced.” So, Cantor Putterman went over, painstakingly, every single syllable of every single prayer that we did, over and over again, so that when I finally wrote the piece, it actually was understandable to the congregation, and, secondly, was doing honor to those magnificent prayers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=507.0,559.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM: And for that, he’s always in my heart with gratitude.  Because otherwise, I would have had colossal mistakes that I wouldn’t have known about.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  This is an entire service?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Is it composed — is that the only, you’ve just written that one service?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=559.0,577.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes.  The only part that I didn’t do, I did a year later, when a Cantor Nathaniel Springer, I believe his name was, in a temple in Newark, said, “The only part you left out of your service was the kaddish.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eAnd, if I’m not mistaken, Cantor Putterman, I think, didn’t want a kaddish for this particular service.  So I, I, I added that to the sacred service.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=577.0,603.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I’ve written many other — I wrote a piece with Langston Hughes, based on the Yizkor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  What’s that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Called Let Us Remember.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  All right.  We’ll come back to that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  But that was my only…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Let me do one…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Sorry.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Let me come back to the service, and then we’ll come to that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Certainly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Let Us Remember. For this service, did you use any traditional material for that?  Do you attempt to use it, or was this…","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=603.0,623.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e No.  I, I tried just to let the music of the, the prayers, the music of the words, and the spirit, dictate what to write.  And I’ve written so many pieces since then that do use traditional materials, from time to time. I’m happy that I did it that way because it now has something that I’m not sure I could do again.  It was inspired at that moment by everything that I’d felt, that I’d never had a chance to write down before.  It was all the feelings that I had up until that point in my life, at the age of 29.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=623.0,661.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And when I was writing it, I kept thinking that my father, and my father’s father, and the people way, way back, and everyone’s fathers and mothers, and all those feelings that we had when you get together in a synagogue, or any kind of group where a lot of Jewish people are together.  And it’s almost the same feeling you have when you are on an American Indian reservation, and suddenly, without speaking, you feel this tremendously strong contact of like a gigantic family feeling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=661.0,692.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that’s not any kind of fake spiritualism or merchandisable mysticism.  I think it’s a concrete fact.  And I’m positive that that feeling is what has kept us able to survive all of the catastrophes, and what keeps all people able to survive.  The spiritual, cultural, musical, artistic, human feeling that is an expression of an extended family and inherited history.  What the great doctor and founder of psychiatry, Karl Jung, called “the collective unconscious.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=692.0,738.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM: I always felt he was the one, rather than Sigmund Freud or any of the others, that really had a handle on what it was about because he acknowledged that mystical part that you couldn’t nail down or put in a bottle or put under glass, but that was there.  That soul, that nishoma.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  This service was done at one of the special, the annual occasions at Park Avenue, right?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  It was what year?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=738.0,765.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e It was done in 1960.  May of 1960.  And I’m not positive of that date — I’d better look, to be sure of that.  But it was done in 1960. And it was conducted by Maurice Peress; a wonderful conductor, whose father had, was a member of the Iraqi Jewish community, and had come over from Baghdad and met his wife in New York, who was Ashkenazic; and had wonderful children, including their son, Maurice, who was, later became Leonard Bernstein’s assistant conductor, and directed the Kansas City Symphony.  He was a marvelous musician; also had a great grasp of Hebrew. And he said, when we were at the rehearsal, he said, “This is the most exciting thing since my bar mitzvah.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=765.0,812.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  And he got all the singers — tremendously talented choral singers, who did not read Hebrew, and most of whom weren’t Jewish, who were extraordinarily good singers — and rehearsed with them and got a magnificent performance.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  And has it been recorded?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  The first performance at the Park Avenue Synagogue, I think there’s acetate…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  No, I mean after that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=812.0,837.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  …somewhere.  Yes, it was recorded, finally.  It was done in 1965 at Town Hall with George Shirley.  A great singer from the Met Opera sang the cantor’s part.  In fact, I remember one time he was, he was so busy…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  But George Shirley — was he a tenor?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBARRY SEROTA:  Yes, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=837.0,855.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  A heldentenor.  Because he came, in addition to being a tenor, he also sung some Wagnerian roles.  At one time, he came from a Wagner…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBARRY SEROTA:  Yeah.  That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  …opera rehearsal, and he still had all the makeup on.  He was in such a hurry.  And he had one of those big hats with horns, and he, he brought it into rehearsal.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  They did the whole service?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=855.0,872.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  Just, just as a joke for all of us.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eAnd the, we did the whole service at a, at a concert, with Bruce Prince Joseph playing the organ.  He was organist with the New York Philharmonic.  And then…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  And what, who were the chorus?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Pardon?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Who was the chorus?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e\t\tDAVID AMRAM:  The chorus was selected by Thomas Pyle, who was the…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Oh, I remember Tommy Pyle.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yeah.  Who had the most wonderful singers.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  He had the best.  There’s nothing like that, now.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  They were all…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  There’s nothing.  You could call Tommy Pyle….  There’s a real need for that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=872.0,894.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  Extraordinary choral singers. And then, in 1967, a group decided to have an ecumenical evening of choral music of all the religions.  In fact, I think it was sponsored by the Catholic church.  And they decided to have my sacred service. They did Mary Lou Williams’ mass.  Only at that point, it wasn’t called Mary Lou Williams’ mass.  Later, it was called Music for Peace.  And, by coincidence, I played French horn and Middle Eastern flutes on her recording of that, which is now out as her mass, I believe.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  So was this done just as a recording, or was it a live performance?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=894.0,938.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  No, this was all live performance.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Where was that done?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  And this was done at Carnegie Hall.  And they recorded — a terrific recording engineer came and recorded a 60-voice chorus.  And we had about two weeks of rehearsals.  Bruce Prince Joseph playing the organ. A wonderful tenor, named Seth McCoy, who sang with all the major symphony orchestras and opera companies, and loved Jewish music and had studied with a cantor, whose, whose diction was so incredible, that cantors hearing that were convinced he must be a great unknown cantor. And I said, “Well, he is, except he doesn’t work as a cantor.  He’s an opera singer and a cantata singer who loves Jewish music.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=938.0,980.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he spent almost a year learning my piece inside out.  And it was an extraordinarily good performance.  And it’s — I have a mint condition master tape, which I was able to…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  And that would be useable now, I mean…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Retrieved, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=980.0,995.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"NEIL LEVIN:  And who conducted the chorus?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  I conducted it myself.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  And a 60-voice chorus?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.  It was, it was just one of those things that would be almost impossible to do now.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Well…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  And especially at Carnegie Hall.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Right.  And then, we must talk about this…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Get me a copy of the master, you know.  So we can…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Absolutely.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  …see what we can do.  Because this is very interesting.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDo you use it — technically, is it just, your approach — harmonic language, counterpoint, and things like that — I mean, how would you characterize it, in that sense?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=995.0,1026.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  I would say, if I were to rewrite it today, I would make it a lot simpler for all the inner voices.  The alto, tenor and bass parts that were singing in conjunction with the melodies, I would try to find a way to make it easier for the singers.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Is that a practical consideration or an artistic consideration?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1026.0,1049.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  I think it’s both; because ultimately, you learn as a composer, the more that you do it, that the more playable and singable it is, the better it can be done, generally. Now, I’m fortunate that I have such an extraordinarily good performance that people can hear the piece and like it.  And they do it because of the fact that it sounds so beautiful when you’re listening to it.  But you learn, very often, from experience, how to do things better. And I learned from that, that in future choral pieces, I would try to make some of the enharmonic changes a little easier for the singers.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  How about the piece that you just started to tell me about…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBARRY SEROTA:  With Langston Hughes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  The one with Langston Hughes, yeah.  What’s that called, that’s the…","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1049.0,1098.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  Yeah, that, that was commissioned by, I believe, by the United Hebrew Congregations of America.  And they had a big concert at the San Francisco Opera House.  And they had the Oakland Symphony.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  When was that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  This was 1965.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Mmm-hmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1098.0,1112.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And I have a review of that, which I, I left for you.  And they did a, a wonderful piece by William Schuman, his music from Judith, with a ballet dancer and an orchestra. They had a piece that Edward G. Robinson narrated.  He was incredible.  Just a joy to see him.  And he was having such a good time, doing something for a Jewish organization that was celebrating Judaism, because most of his roles in Hollywood, of course, were dramatic roles, where he would play gangsters, or tortured people, that really had nothing to do with his own background.  And, of course, he had a tremendous knowledge of Yiddishkeit, as well. And they had Charles Morrow, who was then, I think, the winner of a student award as the best young composer.  They did a piece of his for trumpet and strings that was very, very interesting; and my piece, for two choruses, four soloists, and an orchestra.  And, it was conducted by Gerhardt Samuels.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1112.0,1182.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And again, it was a, a real treat, because it was so well-rehearsed and so well-played, I didn’t have to do anything but go there and enjoy it.  And the text was written by Langston Hughes. And one of the interesting things is, that when Mr. Hughes came, and we spoke to one of the people who was in charge of the commission, because Mr. Hughes was African-American, I think that the, the rabbi who was giving the final approval was speaking to Mr. Hughes. And he said, “Well, Mr. Hughes,” he said, “I admire your work.”  And he said, “We have a parallel history of people who have suffered and struggled and overcame.  But,” he said, “there’s a certain specific feeling of the Jewish people that’s so special…”.  And he kept going on and on. Finally, Mr. Hughes said, “I understand what you mean, rabbi, because my grandfather was Jewish.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eAnd the rabbi, the rabbi roared with laughter.  And then, drew his lecture about what it meant to feel to be Jewish to a close.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1182.0,1246.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM: Because Langston Hughes’ family came from all parts of the world, and all walks of life.  And his grandfather was Jewish.  And Langston told me afterwards, he said, “I realized the rabbi was trying to open up my, my heart and my mind to a certain door that he felt I wasn’t familiar with,” he said.  “But my grandfather had already done that for me.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e\t\tNEIL LEVIN:  The name of this piece is…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  It’s called Let Us Remember.  And it’s based on the, on the Yizkor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  But the text is in English?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBARRY SEROTA:  And there’s also another work that you wrote of a Jewish character; an opera for television, for ABC, I believe it was.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.  That was in…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Called The Final Ingredient?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1246.0,1287.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, that was commissioned, that was done in 1965 on network television.  It was shown four years in a row, and they thought it would be like Amahl and the Night Visitors. Then, ABC, apparently, around 1970 — approximately 1970 — decided that all the black-and-white videotapes had to be destroyed, because color television was becoming so gigantic.  So, they took all of the black-and-white tapes and destroyed them. In 1970, none of us had heard of VCRs, because there weren’t any, or videotapes, or video cassettes. So, fortunately, there was a copy that survived, which is now donated to the Holocaust Museum in New York City, the Holocaust Museum in Washington, the Holocaust Museum in Israel.  I’ll be delighted to give you a copy of that for your archives, as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1287.0,1350.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"NEIL LEVIN:  That’s very important.  That’s, this is coming, this was, you say it was done four years in a row?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  The same performance?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yeah.  It was, it was, it was…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Shown four times.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yeah.  It was shown four times.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  So, it was done on video for television.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1350.0,1362.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  Yes.  It was done on, on video and a kinescope.  And…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Now, this is clearly an opera.  It’s an opera.  And what’s the…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  It was a one-act opera called The Final Ingredient.  And it was based on a story by Reginald Rose.  Originally done for television as a drama, of a true story of a group of people in the Holocaust at a concentration camp who decided that they wanted to celebrate Passover service somehow. And the biggest problem was that they didn’t, they made a, the lamb’s shank out of someone’s belt; the, the salt water was really taken from people’s tears.  All the different ingredients were taken from things that the concentration camp victims could find, from the horrors that they were living in, to substitute for a regular Pesach dinner.  The one thing that was missing was the egg. And there was a bird with a little nest outside the concentration camp wall.  And the whole idea of the opera was getting that final ingredient.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1362.0,1431.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And the son of the protagonist who wanted to have this service done had had a lot of difficulties in his relationship with his father.  And finally, he was able to climb up a tree.  He was the only one strong enough to get the egg without breaking it.  And then, he was murdered in the process.  And they had the Passover service. And it was an extraordinarily moving story, because it was based on a true story that had happened. And when we had the chance to write that as a one-hour opera for ABC Directions, produced by Wiley Hantz, who was a marvelous television producer of quality programming during that time, the libretto was rewritten by Arnold Weinstein, who now, as we speak, in 1998, is completing the libretto for Arthur Miller’s View From the Bridge, commissioned by the Metropolitan Opera.  Arnold’s now 73.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eAnd he said, “David,” he said, “now, I’m the hottest librettist in the United States.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1431.0,1489.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"NEIL LEVIN:  Who’s writing the opera?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  And — William Bolcom.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Oh, Bolcom.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.  A wonderful composer.\tAnd Arnold did the libretto.  He had done other work, but he hadn’t really ever done an opera.  He had done musicals before, and music dramas, but he hadn’t ever written — that was really his first libretto for a one-hour opera. And I was lucky enough to be chosen to have written the music.  And in fact, I used two portions of the sacred service in the opera — the Sh’ma Yisrael, when they sing that; and the Yigdal, at the very end yigdal Elohim chai.  That wonderful prayer, which is a triumphant ending to the opera, which I had used in my sacred service.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1489.0,1537.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:   And the opera was such a success that they showed it four years in a row.  And it recently resurfaced.  And now, with the videocassettes that are left being able to be preserved digitally, people will see what was an extraordinary production that I don’t think would ever happen today.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  And that was a fully staged production?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e\tDAVID AMRAM:  It was a fully staged production.  A wonderful orchestra, the ABC Orchestra.  That was…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBARRY SEROTA:  So \u003cINAUDIBLE\u003e conducting the piece?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  No, I conducted it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBARRY SEROTA:  Oh, you conducted it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  With a chamber orchestra?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1537.0,1568.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, it was about a 30, I’d say about a 30-piece orchestra.  With four horns.  They didn’t have to use an enormous number of strings.  I’d say maybe 30, 34 pieces. And, as a result of the, the CD recording that just came out a year or two ago, they’re interested now in having it done as a dramatic work staged.  Not staged, but done in concert form.  Because the story itself is so strong. And it uses a, a very small chorus, and, and principals.  And a medium-sized orchestra.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1568.0,1603.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eNEIL LEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e How would you characterize yourself as a composer? And technically in these pieces, an atonal composer, a polytonal composer, or do you use any method, or…","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1603.0,1617.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.  I would say, a musical composer.  An honest composer.  A composer that writes from the heart.  And that wants to make every note count. In the world of jazz, when I played with Charles Mingus and Kenny Durham and Thelonious Monk and Dizzy Gillespie — all these magnificent musicians — and when I knew Charlie Parker, 1952, as a kid, the colloquial expression was “choice notes.”  If you were playing a figure, every note that you played on one instrument was supposed to be a perfect, beautiful, meaningful note that made you feel something, and made people with you feel something that related to the moment.  If you were writing something down, all those people that worked in that field would sit there, sometimes, at the piano, pounding away for an hour, to get just the perfect chord.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1617.0,1670.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Now, during that time, in the ‘40s and ‘50s and ‘60s, there were a lot of systems of composing, where it was done cerebrally or mechanically, where it was almost more — the idea was more important than what it sounded like.  The concept of having something sound beautiful was almost considered to be Neanderthal.  And when I showed part of my sacred service to a very distinguished composer of the super-complex, cerebral school, he turned to me and said, “Do you have any interest in 20th-century music?” And I said, “Yes.  Very much so.  I consider myself part of the 20th century.” And I didn’t take it as an insult.  I think what he saw, what I was doing, he thought was like either, either it was startling, or I was a, a Neanderthal moron that did, didn’t really have any concept of some of the wonderful music that had been written during this century.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1670.0,1743.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Of course, I did, because I played with symphony orchestras, and I was playing jazz and Latin music and American Indian music, and Middle Eastern music.  Not only playing them and learning them, but also, formulating the idea of using some of those idioms which I had lived with, by performing and being part of groups where I would sit and play a part, to understand it emotionally and historically and physically, and hope to be able to honor those musics in formal pieces. And the jazz players were the ones who convinced me that it was still possible to write using melody, harmony and counterpoint.  And in fact, there was so much beautiful music in the world that wasn’t even considered to be music by Juilliard and Manhattan School of Music and these other places, that had been here for thousands of years, that maybe, reinforced by my world travels, I would go places where everybody knew about jazz and rock and roll, and George Gershwin and Hank Williams and Jimmie Rodgers and Al Jolson.  But they also had their own, fantastic music.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1743.0,1810.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Sometimes, they knew more about our music than most of us did who live in this country.  And that we knew nothing about their music.  So that encouraged me, when I came home, to continue on the path that, that I was on. And I consider that to be a very Jewish approach — this survivalist instinct of how to make everything come out beautifully.  So that if someone comes by the house and you have to give them a meal, you open up the ice box, so if there’s marmalade and mayonnaise and English muffin, an ear of corn, and some other leftovers, and a few eggs, you figure out the all-time, one-and-only, super-klezmer-type omelet.  And that that, in turn, is the perfect recipe, because you’re taking what is available and making something beautiful out of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1810.0,1864.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  You see, my music is, is very carefully worked out.  Not when I’m improvising, but when I’m actually writing it down. And because I have improvised so much of my life, I take the idea process of what you’re writing down even more seriously.  Because there, you’re completely responsible.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  One of the great cantorial teachers, Max Wohlberg, always told his students that the best improvisation is the one that’s written down. Are we looking at other pieces — did you give Paul any other Judaically related pieces?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1864.0,1894.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  Yes.  I have another piece that I wrote called, it was commissioned by the, the United Suffolk Wives of Long Island, and it was premiered in 1986, called Songs of the Soul, or Shirei neshama.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  You did it in Hebrew or English?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e\t\tDAVID AMRAM:  At — well, the, this was an orchestral piece.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Oh, it’s an orchestral piece.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e\tDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.  The first movement was based on an Ethiopian Passover chant of the, of the exiles who came from Ethiopia to Israel.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Where does this date from?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  I wrote…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  What year?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Oh, 1986.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  So, it’s a more recent piece…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  …than these other ones.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1894.0,1934.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes.  And it uses this wonderful portion of a Passover chant that was just so amazing, the way it was constructed.  And I just took a few measures of that and built the whole first movement around that. The second movement I call Niggun, or Song Without Words.  And it was a series of melodies of my own, but which came out of that same tradition and feeling as the great Yossele Rosenblatt, and the wonderful cantors of Central Europe, to try to capture some of that feeling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1934.0,1965.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"NEIL LEVIN:  Is this a, a large orchestra, a chamber orchestra?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e\t\tDAVID AMRAM:  This is a, I, I’d say, a medium-sized orchestra.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Medium.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  You’ve got about a 40-piece orchestra.  And it’s been done by large orchestras — the Montreal Symphony.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Is there a recording of it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yes.  I have one which I…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Which you gave to Paul?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1965.0,1979.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM:  Yes.  Which I left with you.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  Yeah…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  A cassette, a cassette of a, of a live performance.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  But it would have to be re-recorded if you…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  That has to be re-recorded.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Yeah.  But that’s, that’s an easy one to put together.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  How long a piece is it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e\t\tDAVID AMRAM:  It’s about, I would say, probably, 26 minutes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN:  And the third movement?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1979.0,1999.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And the third movement, I call it Freilekh, or Dance of Joy.  And it uses a traditional melody, l’kha dodi, that was used by the Yemenites who came to Israel on what they called the “magic carpet.”  Many were going on an airplane for the first time in their life. And the melody was taught to me by Avram Pengas, who was born in Greece, brought up in Israel, and then, came to New York City, whom I played with, with a Middle Eastern trio for the last 20-some years.  And we played that piece for years. And I said, “Well, Avram, I love that melody so much,” I said, “I’m going to use it in my symphonic version.  But I want to be positive that every note is right.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSo, he says, “I can’t believe it.”  Because we never rehearsed anything — we just played together, the last 20 years.  He said, “I can’t believe we’re actually sitting down and doing something.” And I sat down with him and went over it and over it and over it.  And I finally called him up and I said, “Avram,” I said, “I want to be sure I have it right.” And he said, “All right.”  He said, “I’ll sing it to you, on your answering machine.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e\tSo he sang it to me on my answering machine.  And I used that as my spell-check, to make certain that I had every little, tiny ornamentation correct.  And I’m happy to say that, that I did.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1999.0,2077.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e And when I performed it in Israel, I think they were shocked that an American-born person would actually know that music correctly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eThe last movement has a wonderful traditional song from the, a Ladino song — Morena Me Llaman, which is a, one that I learned from George Mgrdichian, whom I played with, also, for 30 years, who had done that song so many times. So I used the two, those two traditional melodies.  And it’s in the form of a rondo.  And then, at the very end, all of the themes from all the movements come back again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=2077.0,2108.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DAVID AMRAM: And I have another piece I wrote, called Ode to Lord Buckley — a saxophone concerto, the last movement of which uses the wonderful Sephardic song, Ay Nadir.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNEIL LEVIN: Ay, nadir…\u003cbr\u003eDAVID AMRAM:  Right.  Right.  Exactly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=2108.0,1976.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eNEIL LEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e This sounds like an intriguing piece.  I mean, I’m glad that we talked about this because we should include this piece.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=1976.0,2131.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800/transcript/24258/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eDAVID AMRAM:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.  The, the orchestra pieces are very, very strong pieces.  And they’re done a lot, by people who never even heard anything about Jewish music. And very often, I come and I demonstrate some of the instruments.  I talk about the idea of that  krecht — the tear in the voice.  The concept in, in Jewish music of a people who have traveled and been all over the world, and we have always absorbed where we’ve been and tried to understand where we’ve been, and taken that with us to the next place that we go to.  And we’ve also left something of our own gifts wherever we’ve been.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/39421/file/110800#t=2131.0,2174.016"}]}]}]}