{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/n872v2d384/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Weisgall, Hugo"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/115/original/Boxed_Milken_Center_logo.png?1628711583","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Preferred Citation"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eWeisgall, Hugo. 1995. Interview by Neil W. Levin, Bruce Saylor, Deborah Weisgall, and Jonathan Weisgall. Milken Archive Oral History Project. 31 May.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Publisher"]},"value":{"en":["Milken Family Foundation"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003e© Milken Family Foundation. Unauthorized use is prohibited. For inquiries, please contact info@milkenarchive.org.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Weisgall, Hugo (Composer)","Levin, Neil W. (Interviewer)","Saylor, Bruce (Interviewer)","Weisgall, Deborah (Interviewer)","Weisgall, Jonathan (Interviewer)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["1995-05-31"]}},{"label":{"en":["Coverage"]},"value":{"en":["New York, NY (Place of Recording)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":["English (Primary)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eOral history interview with Hugo Weisgall focused on his family lineage and early childhood, immigration to the US, military service and involvement in World War II, Judaism and personal identity, musical training and career, opera, and compositional style. Encompasses a broad range of topics including the Czech Republic, Jewish liturgical music, Baltimore (Md.), the Chizuk Amuno Congregation, Roger Sessions, Fritz Reiner, the John Hopkins University, the Peabody Conservatory of Music, the Curtis Institute of Music, the Jewish Theological Seminary, and Weisgall's numerous operatic works.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u003ca href=\"https://www.milkenarchive.org/artists/view/hugo-weisgall\"\u003eView Artist Page from the Milken Archive\u003c/a\u003e\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["Beta SP"]}},{"label":{"en":["Subject"]},"value":{"en":["Jews -- Music (Topical Term)","Oral Histories (genre/form)","America -- Emigration and immigration (Topical Term)","Ivančice (Czech Republic) (Topical Term)","Chizuk Amuno Congregation (Baltimore, Md.) (Person Or Corporate Body)","Maryland -- Baltimore (Topical Term)","Peabody Conservatory of Music (Person Or Corporate Body)","John Hopkins University (Md.) (Person Or Corporate Body)","Curtis Institute of Music (Person Or Corporate Body)","Scalero, Rosario, 1870-1954 (Person Or Corporate Body)","World War, 1939-1945 (Topical Term)","Opera (Topical Term)","Fort George G. Meade (Md.) (Person Or Corporate Body)","Schuman, William, 1910-1992 (Person Or Corporate Body)","Prague (Czech Republic) (Topical Term)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Keyword"]},"value":{"en":["Advancing American Art (book), aide-de-camp, America -- Emigration and immigration, Anschluss movement (1918-1938), Baltimore Symphony Orchestra, Béla Bartók (1881-1945), Betzeis yisroel (song), Camp Airy (Md.), Camp Albert C. Ritchie (Md.), cantor, Chizuk Amuno Choral Society, Chizuk Amuno Congregation (Baltimore, Md.), Curtis Institute of Music, Czech Republic, David Popper (1843-1913), England -- London, Esther (opera), ethnomusicology, Evening Liturgies (liturgical work), Fort George G. Meade (Md.), Franz C. (Franz Carl) Bornschein (1879-1948), George S. (George Smith) Patton (1885-1945), H.L. Miller Cantorial School, Har Sinai Congregation (Baltimore, Md.), Hartford Choral Society (Md.), hazzan, Hilltop Opera Company, Hopkins Symphony Orchestra (Md.), Ivančice (Czech Republic), Jacob Barkin, Jan Masaryk (1886-1948), Jewish diaspora, Jewish Theological Seminary of America, John Hopkins University (Md.), London (England), London Symphony Orchestra, Love's Wounded (symphonic work), Maryland -- Baltimore, Mauretania (Ship : 1938-1965), Maurice Goldman (1910-1984), Modernism (Music), Moshe Davis (1916-1996), New Jersey -- Newark, New York -- New York City, Nine Rivers from Jordan (opera), One Thing is Certain (ballet), opera, Otto Ortmann (1889-1979), Outpost (ballet), Peabody Conservatory of Music, Phi Beta Kappa, Prague (Czech Republic), Rabbinical Assembly, Roger Sessions (1896-1985), Rosario Scalero (1870-1954), Rosh Hashanah (sacred service / high holiday), Salomon Sulzer (1804-1890), Soldier Songs (song cycle), T'kiatot (symphonic work), The Mighty Casey (opera; by William Schuman), The Stronger (opera), The Wall (opera), Washington Hebrew Congregation (Washington, D.C.), William Schuman (1910-1992), World War I, World War II, Zionism, Zionist Organization of America"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eOral history interview with Hugo Weisgall focused on his family lineage and early childhood, immigration to the US, military service and involvement in World War II, Judaism and personal identity, musical training and career, opera, and compositional style. Encompasses a broad range of topics including the Czech Republic, Jewish liturgical music, Baltimore (Md.), the Chizuk Amuno Congregation, Roger Sessions, Fritz Reiner, the John Hopkins University, the Peabody Conservatory of Music, the Curtis Institute of Music, the Jewish Theological Seminary, and Weisgall's numerous operatic works.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u003ca href=\"https://www.milkenarchive.org/artists/view/hugo-weisgall\"\u003eView Artist Page from the Milken Archive\u003c/a\u003e\u003c/p\u003e"]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003e\u0026copy; Milken Family Foundation. Unauthorized use is prohibited. For inquiries, please contact info@milkenarchive.org.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Lowell Milken Center for Music of American Jewish Experience"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Lowell Milken Center for Music of American Jewish Experience"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/115/original/Boxed_Milken_Center_logo.png?1628711583","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/116/737/small/WesigallFB.jpg?1622905827","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - L3925-B17792_Hugo_Weisgall_Combined.mp4"]},"duration":13516.416,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/116/737/small/WesigallFB.jpg?1622905827","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-milken.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/116/737/original/L3925-B17792_Hugo_Weisgall_Combined.mp4?1622839047","type":"Video","format":"video/mp4","duration":13516.416,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["Hugo Weisgall [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e My earliest memory of myself is singing in the choir on Yom Kippur in the year 1915, and I was singing in the choir, and they had received, my great-uncle, Uncle Bacche, had received a telegram that day saying that his son was missing in action.  And my... Rosaneni, my great-aunt, never left the house again.  But that’s my first memory of myself ‑‑ in the synagogue, singing Amnam ken.  Ki hinne kahomer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=15.0,54.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Which comes right at the same...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  The same thing.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  One page apart in the Kol Nidre service.  But that was which synagogue?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  In Ivančice, in Ivančice.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And you were three years old.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You were three years old.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I was three years old.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Your father was not there, I assume.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My father was in the army.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Your father was a cantor already?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, but he was...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  He was the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ...was fighting on the...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=54.0,75.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Was fighting or was he chaplain, or...?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, he was a regular, actually, he was a telephone operator.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  In the Austro-Hungarian army.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  When did he come to Ivančice?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  When did he come?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I believe in the year 1910.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And where had he studied?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=75.0,90.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  He had studied in Lutsklovack[?] with Ersler, Josef Ersler.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh, yeah.  Well, you talked about Ersler all the time, but I never made this connection.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  And my father, in those days, was with a traveling opera company ‑‑ a light opera company.  And he did light opera roles, romantic roles.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=90.0,113.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Such as?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  But...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You mean like the Viennese things, Gallman and that sort of thing, yeah?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, must have been stuff like that, obviously.  And he, being a nice Jewish boy, he always got himself a meal for Friday night, and obviously went to the cantor of the... whatever places they were playing, and that’s how he...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=113.0,141.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Did he become a cantor because he could not make it as an opera singer, or did he become a cantor out of some desire to pursue that as a career?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s a question I don’t... a, wouldn’t get into, because I don’t, psychobiography is kind of difficult.  He became a cantor because that was something that he knew how to do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=141.0,162.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  In the days that he was traveling around, he also acted as cantor on the weekend, if there was a congregation...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Without a cantor?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ...who needed him.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did he study in Vienna as well?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, he did.  He studied in Vienna with a man named Jacob Bower, who was the cantor of the Turkish synagogue.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=162.0,180.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  You’ve talked before about people emphasizing your being born in Czechoslovakia, and you’ve said that that’s really kind of an accident.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Explain that ‑‑ what do you mean by that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, my father was born in Poland.  And when he met my mother, he was living in... he was in Austria, yes, it was Austria.  My mother was born in Hungary, and that’s how they got together, but I’m... the point is, that I’m not a Czech.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=180.0,214.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Wasn’t your point also that he just happened to have landed a job?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He had a job.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Talk about that ‑‑ how did he get hired?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  He happened to, in Slawenburg, in Steimel[?], which was a fairly important town, he got a job in a synagogue with a man named ‑‑ God! ‑‑ Forg, no, not Forg, Goodfreud.  And they liked him, they latched onto him, and gave him food and things, and finally he became, he was offered a job.  And at that point, at the same time that he was offered a job in Steimel, the position of assistant cantor in Ivančice was opened, and he applied for it and got it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=214.0,265.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  How far back does the cantorial tradition go in the family?  His father?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  His father was a hazzan, too.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And before that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Before that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Something, and I actually want to, I’m not sure that my memory’s correct in this, but something you told me once, at one point, someone was a cantor in Vienna?  Or was it someone that knew Sulzer?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=265.0,291.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Something about Sulzer’s being invited for Friday night once, or something like that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yeah, the story in my great-uncle’s family was that Sulzer used to be invited for fish on Friday night and went to this person’s house.  And my great-uncle inherited Sulzer’s tuning fork.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=291.0,316.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  This was on your mother’s side.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  This was Bacche?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSEROTA:  What happened to the tuning fork?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  It’s upstairs.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You still have it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I have it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And it’s thought to be Sulzer’s tuning fork?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So we could have had that on exhibition.  I know somebody who’ll give you a lot of money for it in Austria, seriously.  Talk to him about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=316.0,332.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  I’m sorry.  Which great-uncle was it who had this...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Uncle Bacche.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  This was Bacche, that’s what I thought.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  There were cantors...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Bacche was Sulzer’s... was in the last batch of students that Sulzer had.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Okay.  And when your father was hired at Ivančice as the under-cantor, the ober-cantor was Bacche.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=332.0,350.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Okay.  Except, yeah, the ober-cantor of each synagogue was really the first cantor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right, Herr Ober.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And the second one, was just called the cantor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Just the cantor, that’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.  Yeah.  The... Model made a joke about that once, he said, “Now they call them hazzan rishon, hazzan tahton.”  Above, and so they’d be under them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=350.0,371.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  And that’s where Abba met your mother.  Because she was Bacche’s...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  She was Bacche’s niece.  Bacche’s wife was my, was my grandmother’s sister.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  That was Rosaneni.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=371.0,389.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Rosaneni.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What was she doing living with Bacche and not with her parents?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Rosaneni?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  No, your mother.  What was your mother...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, my mother ran away from home.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Would you talk about that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: My mother... my grandmother was the dominant force in the family.  She was from an aristocratic family, and they had money.  And she was also a descendant of Hassan Sofer, the very famous rabbi in Bratislava in Pressburg.  And she ruled the roost.  And she was always sick, and made my mother out to be the kitchen maid, until my mother got tired of it and left.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=389.0,433.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  She had other daughters?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  She had two other daughters.  She had altogether, she altogether had six children, I think.  My mother and her two sisters...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Margitte and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Margitte and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Hedwig?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=433.0,451.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  And Hedwig, and Adshe.  Four girls and three boys ‑‑ Mauritz, what was the other one’s name, Baila[?], and one other who died.  But they all went to school, and my grand-....\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Except for your mother.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Except for your mother.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=451.0,469.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  My grandmother insisted my mother stay home.  So she left.  Which is the boldest thing she ever did in her life.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And she went to live...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  With her aunt, Rosaneni.  I mean, Rosaneni’s her blood relative, but she’s... got married.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Now was Rosaneni her mother’s relative or her father’s?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Her mother’s sister.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=469.0,489.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Her mother’s sister.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So she was aristocratic as well, but she wasn’t....\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, but she never behaved that way.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Now, aristocratic ‑‑ what do you mean?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, a well-known Jewish family.  You know, that you look up in the dictionary, the Stricker, Robert Stricker, the great friend of Theodor Herzl and all of that.  It was just a very well-cultured and...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=489.0,515.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  What’s called in Yiddish yiches.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yiches, that’s right, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Back to your maternal grandfather.  Tell what was his name and tell us a little bit about him.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  His name was Armin Stricker, Stricker, S-t-r-i-c-k-e-r, Armin, A-r-m-i-n.  His Hebrew name was Bezalel.  And he was a teacher in a gymnasium.  And his job was, he was very good on languages.  His job... he was sent to the provinces of Slovakia, where they tried to maturize the Slovaks.  And my grandfather, my grandfather was one of those who was sent.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=515.0,565.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But probably even more interesting than that, I think, is the fact that my grandfather was a graduate of the most famous rabbinical school in Germany, whose name escapes me.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Where?  Do you remember what part of Germany?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Must have been Eastern.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Not Frankfurt?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  Do you know any...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, not from the Broyer crowd in Frankfurt.   Hildesheimer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=565.0,589.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Hildesheimer, Hildesheimer, yes.  But he never became a rabbi.  Although he...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  The Hildesheimer was in Berlin.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Was there any musical tradition on your mother’s side?  It seems to have been more rabbinical.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What were...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=589.0,603.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah.  They were all very musical.  My aunt Adshe graduated from the Budapest Conservatory.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  As a musician?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  As a pianist.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  As a pianist?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  And the whole family was very, very musical ‑‑ all of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=603.0,619.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Isn’t that Ma’oz tsur we sing written by one of...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Ma’oz tsur’s written by my grandfather, my paternal...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Your paternal grandfather?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  This is a family melody?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Now I’m dying to hear what it sounds like.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Sing it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=619.0,641.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Charlie Davidson uses it all the time, now.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh, that’s what he... he’s harmonized it, or, just...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, he just uses the tune.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Hugo’s harmonized it.  Abba...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  In my father’s book, there’s an arrangement that I did.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  In his father’s book.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh.  Okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=641.0,656.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Go back for a moment to that first Yom Kippur and the cable that Bacche’s and Rosaneni’s son was missing.  There’s that marker at the cemetery, because I gather there were other...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: ...boys as well.  Talk about that a little bit.  What exactly were the circumstances?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=656.0,676.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Of what?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Well, of all of these boys going off.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, this, that was at the end of the war.  When they, when Austria was finished, and they began to put up... it was Czechoslovakia by then.  And there was a monument to the Jews of Ivančice who had died.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=676.0,692.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  When did Abba come back?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My father... from the war?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  19-, I think early November, 1918.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So you were five, just five years...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Six.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Six years old.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=692.0,709.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  So he was gone from about age two and a half, maybe, till six?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You must tell the story of your distaste of fish, and what you think it could be about.  Tell us that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=709.0,724.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, I remember as a child...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You don’t eat fish at all.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  As a child, everybody, my father was coming home on leave, and everybody was talking about the fact that they were gonna have something very special ‑‑ fish.  Fish ‑‑ and I looked forward to fish, and they had fish, and I hated it.  So I never ate it again.  But it was a special treat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=724.0,749.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  What did it have to do with Abba coming, with your father coming home?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, they got it for him.  They got it for my father, ‘cause he was home on leave for a few days.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So you saw him periodically?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  There are two definite instances when I saw him.  I call it two definite.  My mother used to say that my father came home, and I was sitting at my little table having breakfast.  And my father said, “Vas du harech speden?”  And I said, “Aloff, papa.  Aloff, papa.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=749.0,782.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  So Uncle Bacche was... acted as your father?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You spent time... how did you, did you see him every day, did you...?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Who, Uncle Bacche?  Every day.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Where did you live?  Did you live close to them, in the same house?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Hmm-mmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=782.0,796.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  We saw it, but did you live, did they live in the same house?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, they lived where the synagogue is.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Right next to the synagogue.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  There was just one synagogue, I take it, there, right?  They had their Coll Synagogue, they had a chorus, or....?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  They had a choir.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  They did.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, it wasn’t that... the congregation, I don’t think, was that wealthy anymore.  But I don’t know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=796.0,816.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But did they have... your memories of that synagogue go until you’re the age of what?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, until the age of... till we left.  Till 1920.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: There was some kind of a choir?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes, there was a regular choir, of course.  With organ.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=816.0,831.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Uh-huh, okay, the typical... all right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  With a female, non-Jewish, organist.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But no women in the choir.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh yes, oh yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  There were women in the choir?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Really?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.  And the daughter...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So it really was a liberal kind of...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  And the daughter of the mayor, whose name was Steiner, used to have (inaudible), and I always joked to the fact that she would sing, (sing), “Ki, anoch anu...” with the accent.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=831.0,861.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  You were, what? how old, when you have your last recollections of the synagogue?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  About 1920.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So that makes you how old?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Eight.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Eight, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Seven.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=861.0,874.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  So do you have any recollections of what kind of thing they sang there?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, sure, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I mean, was it...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  A lot of the music that my father brought over to Chizuk Amuno is from the music in Ivančice.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Sulzer?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Sulzer, Lewandowski...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Lewandowski...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=874.0,892.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Naumbourg.  Levy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  What about Ersler?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Ersler.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Heller?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Heller.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yes?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My father knew Heller, and was a great friend of his.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So they did the music, the choral arrangements, Heller then, Gottbater?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Who?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=892.0,909.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Gottbater, is that...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, sure.  But, no, that’s not until this country.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Okay.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Gottbater comes when we’re...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But definitely, those composers.  That was the kind of repertoire even in this...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Bachman.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Bachman, yeah?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So even in a relatively small synagogue, I mean, not what you would call a Horshul, certainly...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=909.0,928.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Still, they did that repertoire.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, it was... one of the things that I realized when we went to Ivančice three years ago, I’d imagined a somewhat dusty, sad, little town, strung along a highway somewhere.  It was an extraordinarily beautiful place.  And a valley, with gentle green hills coming up on either side. The synagogue was large and golden, with great limestone blocks.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=928.0,961.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: It seems to me, Ivančice was an ancient Jewish community.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, it was.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  When is the first record of Jews there?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, I don’t know, 11th century or something like that.  I’m not sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  There’s a tombstone that goes back to, I think, 1500, in the cemetery.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=961.0,977.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  So tell, well, why don’t you tell us what kind of Jewish community it was?  Because it has a very... it had a very rich tradition.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I didn’t... I really don’t know too much about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=977.0,992.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  It was one of the designated...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, but I mean, these, this is historical stuff, I don’t want to talk about it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  As far as your own recollections, you’re too young to have...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, I also don’t know too much about it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But it was a kind of community with just one synagogue?  Or was there also an Orthodox...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=992.0,1007.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  At what part, what is today, actually?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What is it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, today’s...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, what was it, during the war, you saw the synagogue in 1945?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And what...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But it’s not a functioning synagogue today, is it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, no.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ‘Cause no Jews came back.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  There weren’t Jews.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1007.0,1023.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  And politically, I mean, in terms of the geopolitical circumstance, what country is it today?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Today, it’s Chechnya.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  It’s the Czech Republic.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Czech Republic, all right.  And before?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  It was Czechoslovakia.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1023.0,1037.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  How far is it from Vienna?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Three hours?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Or from Prague, for that matter.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  How far?  Three hours?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  About three hours.  It’s three hours almost due north of Vienna.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And southeast of Prague.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1037.0,1052.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Two-and-a-half hours from Prague, two hours from Prague, really.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And the primary spoken language there is Czech?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Czech.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And it was then, too?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  No.  But what did you speak?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  German.  All Jews spoke German, except those who tried to be very patriotic and speak Czech.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1052.0,1069.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  So your... the language in your household, the first language was German, from the beginning?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My native language was German.  My mother’s native language was Hungarian, and my father, I think, spoke Yiddish as a child.  But he probably forgot it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1069.0,1086.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  And then growing up, in school in Ivančice, was it, were you taught in German until the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The first year?  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Why were you taught in German?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?  Because it was Austria, and German was the language.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Was the official language of the school system.  So all the children...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  The official language of the government.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1086.0,1104.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  But everyone around you spoke Czech.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, the peasants.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And then when Czechoslovakia became an independent country...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  It immediately became Czech.  I was in a German school one day, and the next day, I was in a Czech school.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And did you learn Czech in that...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1104.0,1122.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah.  But I was apparently very good in Czech.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  But you don’t remember.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The only word I remember is krau, which means king.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So when you came to the United States, you were eight.  Your father came as a cantor?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1122.0,1138.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, he came and he got a job, two or three days after he arrived.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But he wasn’t one of those who was invited from Europe to take a... which was very big in that period of time.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  The cantor in Baltimore became sick, Herman Glass, and I don’t know how they discovered that my father was here ‑‑ probably through Meyer –","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1138.0,1158.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Meyer your uncle?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My father’s brother.  And he was invited to Baltimore for the High Holidays.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1158.0,1165.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJ. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Could we back up a little bit before getting you over there?  ‘Cause that, I think, is a good story in and of itself.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eFirst of all, let’s go back to your paternal grandfather, Solomon, whom you mentioned briefly, because he was the one who wrote that Ma’oz tsur.  First of all, when... what are your memories of him?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1165.0,1185.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I have very few memories of him.  I disliked him.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Why?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He did something to me that I never got over.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  We arrived in New York a few days after his favorite son was drowned, Mende, Emmanuel.  And they were still sitting shiva when we came.  So it was, you know, it must have been a very tense situation ‑‑ my mother, by the way, being way out of this.  She didn’t speak Yiddish, and... they weren’t very helpful to her at the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1185.0,1229.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I remember going to the bathroom one day ‑‑ oh, it was in New York that I discovered this, that toilet paper came in rolls ‑‑ so I remember tearing off a huge piece and putting it out the window, like a banner.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1229.0,1247.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In the bathroom, I was succeeded on the pot, and there on the floor, must have been, I don’t know how much change, maybe two dollars worth.  And I picked it up and put it in my pocket, and didn’t say anything.  And finally, I said I have this, and my grandfather accused me of having broken into his... into Mende’s bank and stealing the money.  And that just absolutely, well I don’t remember anything else about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1247.0,1287.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  How long had he been in this country?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know, I think probably since 1903.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you had actually met him for the first time...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  ...in...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  When we came.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  While he was sitting shiva for his son.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you barely knew him when this incident occurred.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Barely knew.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1287.0,1301.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But this is very unusual in a way, I mean, in terms of immigrant... history of immigration.  Your father’s father came first.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Usually other way around.  And let’s say, as early as 1903, but up until, let’s say, the outbreak of the First World War, I mean, your father had no particular plans to come to America.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1301.0,1323.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  None.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  None.  None.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  When did he... why did he decide to come?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  After the war, my Uncle Meyer wrote him a letter and invited him to come.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And Meyer had been here since...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, Meyer hadn’t... where?  Here?  In New York, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  In New York.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Since about 1905, is that correct?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1323.0,1339.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes.  1905 or 03.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Well, about then.  And Meyer fought for whom, in World War I, by the way?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What did Meyer do during World War I?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He didn’t fight, I don’t think.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  He was not in the Army?  I thought he was in the U.S. Army?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Was he in the American Army?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  If you don’t know, you don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  He certainly wasn’t in anything else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1339.0,1357.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  If he had been, they obviously would have been two brothers in opposing armies.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Although I don’t know, the American forces never really engaged the Austrian forces, did they?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Only the German forces.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1357.0,1370.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: No, of course not, the Austrians were on the Eastern front.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Before getting you to this country, I want to go back to music a little bit.  What was your earliest musical training?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  On piano.  My teacher was the organist Ruben Ofstein.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Was the organist.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  The organist in the synagogue?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  How old were you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I must have been four or five.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1370.0,1389.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Was there a piano in the house?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Let’s talk about, again, before 1920.  So before you were eight years old.  Did you ever get exposure to a larger musical scene than Ivančice?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1389.0,1402.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Before 1920?  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You never went to Vienna?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  When did you see your first opera?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I think it was 1926.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Where?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Vienna.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You came back to Vienna?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1402.0,1415.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: Came back to Ivančice in 1926 for four or five months, with my mother and my brother.  My father stayed in Baltimore.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And you went to Vienna to the opera.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  We went, while we were in Vienna, we went to the opera.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What else did you see?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The Queen of Sheba.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And can you remember any of the conductors?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1415.0,1437.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, I think that Richard Strauss conducted either Lohengrin or The Queen of Sheba.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did you know anything about opera by then?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.  Yes.  I did, I knew, I knew about Wagner.  I don’t think I knew anything else.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  From your father, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1437.0,1455.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  From your father, or from general education?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  From my mother’s family, kind of.  We have a little plaster bust downstairs, which the man who was killed, you know, on that Yom Kippur day when they got the telegraph...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Victor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1455.0,1472.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  He had a bust of Richard Wagner on his piano.  And Wagner was the great musical figure.  Nobody else.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  This was Victor who was missing in action.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.  That’s right.  Victor Lurdenzahn[?].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1472.0,1489.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  And tell me again, what did Rosa Nini do after that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  She would, she would never, she never left the house.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Waiting for him?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Literally did not leave.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Literally did not leave, even to go to the grocery.  She sat there. I remember her with her black shawl, sitting on a chain, you know, a bent wood chain, a chair, sitting in front of the house, and never moving.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1489.0,1518.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Did she expect him to come back?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  The tuning fork story reminds me of one other musical connection.  There was a musical connection between your father, through the Army, and Schubert.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1518.0,1531.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, yes, my father’s, my father’s commanding officer was a man named Richard Von Troya, whose family commissioned the first performance of this Schubert C-major quintet.  And Von Troya ‑‑ my father was his orderly ‑‑ and when they were separated, he gave my father a silver cigarette box with the names of the different places where they had served.  I have that upstairs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1531.0,1565.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  You have that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Do you remember ‑‑ I gather, when you left in 1920 to come to the United States, your world was not bigger than ‑‑ had not been bigger than Ivančice.  Do you remember...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I’d been to Budapest.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1565.0,1580.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  You had been to Budapest.  Do you remember what your journey was to get to the States?  Any memories of that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Talk about that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  We... I don’t know how this was maneuvered, but all of a sudden, there was a... after the war, the Sokols, the Czech patriotic organization, were going to have their annual tour in gymnastics, yes ‑‑ they were a gymnastic group, the Sokols, the Worels, and the Maccabbees.  And they came to Prague, they were going to Prague, and they must have hired a train.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1580.0,1624.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But the interesting thing is that my father managed to get visas, tickets, through Masarek’s sisters.  That’s how we came to this country.  Jan ‑‑ not Jan ‑‑ Tomas Masarek’s sister got my father the way to come over here, the visas.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1624.0,1649.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we were on the train with the Sokols from Prague to Paris.  And you know, they all spoke Czech, of course.  I didn’t know any Czech, but they were on this train.  And the first English word I ever knew was “Sure.  Sure.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1649.0,1671.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Didn’t you always talk about wanting to run away with the circus?  Didn’t you threaten to do that as a little boy once?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You didn’t do that?  Oh, I thought that was the explanation.  So you went through Paris, and then how did you come to the States?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  On the boat.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What boat?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The Mauretania.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Do you remember the voyage at all?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, God, my mother was sick the whole time.  Yes, I do.  Yeah, I also remember one thing ‑‑ the steward serving tea.  Did you want tea?  And tea, of course, was bouillon.  I never drank such awful stuff in my life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1671.0,1698.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  So you didn’t come... I’m trying to figure out kind of where you were on the socioeconomic scale at this point.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Tourist class.  \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You mentioned earlier about your mother not speaking Yiddish.  I mean, as a, really, quite as an aristocrat.  Was there any sense in her family that she was marrying down when she married your father?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1698.0,1718.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t know.  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, no.  Actually, it depends.  She came from where?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eALL:  From Budapest.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You know, there’s an aristocratic Yiddish-speaking group, too.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Of course.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1718.0,1731.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  She spoke German also, or not?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  She spoke Slovak, German, Czech, and then, later in life, English.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah, because the Budapest is a complicated matter.  I mean, people like Wohlberg, for example, was German-speaking as well as Yiddish-speaking.  It’s a different....","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1731.0,1751.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I think in my grandfather’s family they spoke Hungarian.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  When you came to this country, did you go through the Ellis Island routine?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, no.  Got right off the boat.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Hmmm-mmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Were you met?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Met in a taxi.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1751.0,1766.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But where?  In New York?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  By whom, and where did you go?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Meyer, and we went to 980 Prospect Avenue in the Bronx.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Where your grandfather was living.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Sitting shiva for Mendy.\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did you know anything about America?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1766.0,1779.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e No.  No, but I apparently had studied English for a year or so, or six months, with the rabbi of the synagogue in Ivančice, whose name was Handel, H-a-n-d-e-l, who was a graduate of Oxford.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1779.0,1795.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  The rabbi?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Hmmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So he was what was called in the 19th century a preaching rabbi.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  A preaching rabbi, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Do you have any sense of the size of that congregation in Ivančice?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1795.0,1809.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Maybe 250, 300, maybe more.  I don’t know.  But there are facts available, Guido Kahn has all of those facts.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Was there... you said before that there was a wall in...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1809.0,1824.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  The street I lived on had a wall, the confining walls of the ghetto.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  When you were there?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That goes back to the point before the modern... before the Emancipation?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, no, no.  It actually lasted through the beginning of this century.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  The ghetto?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1824.0,1840.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes.  The wall.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But I mean, used as a ghetto.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So in school, were there Jewish children as well as non-Jews?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, there were certainly a lot of non-Jews.  I had a few Jewish friends.  But I had mixed friends ‑‑ Jewish and Christian.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1840.0,1866.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Did your parents have any friends outside the Jewish community?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  We want to talk about the synagogue...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Oh, the synagogue after the war.  Wait till we’re... are we rolling?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eCAMERAMAN:  Go ahead.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  After the war, I was in Prague, sent to Prague...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You’re talking about the Second World War?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1866.0,1881.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Second War, yes.  And I don’t know how long I was there ‑‑ maybe five or six days in Prague.  And I obviously wanted to go back to Czechoslovakia.  No, actually, this was even earlier than that.  This was, I think, slightly before the war was over.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1881.0,1901.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I wanted to go to Hungary, and I took my command car and my crew, and we got to the Hungarian border, and despite the fact that I had diplomatic recognition, the Russians sent me back.  I couldn’t get through.  They just didn’t give a hoot about American.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1901.0,1925.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But then I went to try to go to Ivančice, and I got to Ivančice, and there was absolutely nothing.  The synagogue had been used as a stable by the Germans, and been completely kind of ripped apart.  And the cemetery was mined, so we could never go, actually go to see any of the graves, because the Germans had left it mined.  And by the time I came, it was still mined ‑‑ it hadn’t been cleared.  And the synagogue.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1925.0,1960.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then, when we went there three or four years ago, they’ve turned the synagogue into a factory, but they’ve re-gilt everything, it’s been in very good shape.  And even the old cemetery chapel, with the names of all those people, is being reconstituted somehow.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1960.0,1980.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Didn’t somebody give them money?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, the Jewish community of BRNO is... feels kind of responsible for Ivančice.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  What about the lettering on the synagogue?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1980.0,1995.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  What about it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  On the outside?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, they did that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  But was that there right after the war, or did they put it back?  Or had that always remained?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  I think it was probably there during the war, too.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  We were just talking about your opera experience, and when you heard Lohengrin in 1926, that was a first for you.  I mean, did that... did you develop any automatic affinity for opera as a medium, or...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=1995.0,2026.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, I can’t say that.  All I remember is being terribly aware of the fact that the tenor was at least two feet smaller than the soprano.  And that kind of bothered me.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  We want to get to Baltimore and move it along, but the one other story that I just... you had talked about your adverse reaction to Abba’s father.  What was your relationship like with your mother’s father?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2026.0,2049.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Not very good.  He thought I was very impolite.  He said he objected to the fact that when I came into the room, I did not go up to the ladies’ hands and pick up them, and kiss them on the wrist.  With [?] which is, “I kiss your hand.”  Well, I just didn’t do it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2049.0,2069.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e This was when?  In 19...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2069.0,2082.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, this was 1926.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So you’d been in American schools...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, oh, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ...and you had....  Did you go to Budapest on that trip...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ...as well?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Hmmm-mmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Incidentally, before... just one other quick question.  Your paternal grandmother you never knew, is that correct?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2082.0,2101.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, ‘cause she died before I was born.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Okay, what about your paternal, your maternal grandmother?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Lady’s mother.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Lady’s mother.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What was her name?  What are your memories?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, she was a very, very nice lady.  I liked her a great deal.  Her name was Charlotte ‑‑ that’s where Charlotte...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2101.0,2120.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  That’s right.  Of course.  That’s where Charlotte comes from.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  She had... there’s a musical thing about my grandmother.  There was a fire in the Vienna opera house in the 1860s.  A very famous fire, burnt a great deal of stuff.  And she was at that fire.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2120.0,2139.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"She was also related to the cellist, Popper.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That’s the one who wrote... that cello students still pay the opera stuff, that’s the same Popper?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.  Right.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Karl Popper, or David Popper.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know what his name was.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  David, I think, David Popper, yes.  They were cigar manufacturing people.  And that was her other claim to yichus, that she was at the Vienna fire, and she also knew Popper.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2139.0,2166.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Now I understand you studied the cello for a while?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Where?  In New York?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Baltimore.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  In Baltimore.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Why?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Why?  Because I was trying to do what I think every student should do, every musician should do, is to learn to play an instrument other than the piano.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2166.0,2183.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But how’d it get to be cello?  Violin was the big thing for...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t recall why.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Where else did you live in this period of time in New York, in the New York area?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, for about six months, we left Prospect Avenue and went to live with my Uncle Louie on 348 Hillside Avenue, in Newark, New Jersey.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2183.0,2202.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  In Newark?  So you lived there for a while?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLevin:  What I want to know, is during this time...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Weequahic Park.  Phillip Roth and I both...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did Louie ever take you to the opera?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  At what age?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  In New York.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2202.0,2215.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, yes.  Oh I used to... on Thanksgiving, I came to New York every year and my Uncle Louie would take me to the opera.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  To the Met?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Three days in a row... oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  This was in the early ‘20s?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Early 1920s, yes?  What are your memories there?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, Elizabeth Rethberg, in La Campana Sommersa, and Rosa Ponselle as Santuzza, and Lucrezia Borgia as...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2215.0,2245.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Lucrezia Borgia as (inaudible).  Lawrence Tibbett at Emperor Jones.  Salome.  Johnny Skiki...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2245.0,2264.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  By the way, all of this, though, is after 1926, though?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Because you’re absolutely certain that Lohengrin...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Right.  Right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Now.  What got your father to Baltimore ‑‑ how did that happen?  Why did he move there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2264.0,2277.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Because there was a job there as cantor of...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  What did he do here?  I mean was he, did he function as a cantor in the Bronx at all?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So what did he do...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did he do any...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know what he tried, but he probably was a schnorrer, I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSEROTA:  Did he sing any opera?  Did he do any recitals?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2277.0,2290.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  He began to study, there was a time there, when we came, when my father’s parents, two of them, I think, wanted him to become an opera singer, and the other didn’t, said, “Hold on to a job ‑‑ you’ll starve.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But during the New York years, do you have any recollections of synagogue music?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2290.0,2307.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Nothing...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Not a thing.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ...at all.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Not even whether you went, ‘cause the family...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I never went to shul in New York or in Newark.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So your family didn’t.  Louie didn’t go, or your grandfather didn’t go...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Must have gone on the holidays.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Huh?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You must have gone on the holidays.  Your father didn’t have a job for the holidays?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2307.0,2323.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes ‑‑ it was in Baltimore, but we lived in New York, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh, oh, I see.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So you didn’t even go to shul on Yom Kippur.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  I don’t know whether we did nor not ‑‑ I don’t remember.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But you don’t have any recollection of singing anything, or hearing any music...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  Absolutely not.  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...or what synagogue you went to.  So the first American synagogue experience is in Baltimore.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2323.0,2339.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Is Baltimore, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And who hired your father ‑‑ how did that happen?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Uh, well, there’s a committee that interviewed him.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  I mean, he just applied for the job...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He applied for the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...I mean, in those days, we didn’t have any place for the service, so...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  But he heard about it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  They were told that here was this brilliant new cantor from Europe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2339.0,2356.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  And who was on the committee and what happened?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, the committee, well...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Al Moses.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, I know ‑‑ Al Moses.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  No.  Luz.  The father.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The head of the American Jewish Committee.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  No, no, no, no...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLevin:  It must have been his father.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  His father, dad.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2356.0,2375.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  His father was Leslie Moses, and hired my father.  And...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  This was an opening that came up for the High Holidays?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, yes, the cantor became sick.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  The cantor got sick.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But it was just for the holidays?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Originally, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  But then, after the holidays, they hired him permanently.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  The cantor died.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, he didn’t die.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2375.0,2389.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  He was sick.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He was sick, and my father used to visit him every Saturday afternoon.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So the whole family moved to Baltimore, and he became the hazzan at Chizuk Amuno...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And at that time, I mean, it was what ‑‑ they called it a full-time position?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2389.0,2406.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  No one spoke about taking a job in those days ‑‑ they were “called to the pulpit.”  So-and-so was called to the pulpit.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSEROTA:  You.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But actually, it wasn’t like today ‑‑ it was primarily singing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2406.0,2422.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Cantorially.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, my father did a lot of pastoral.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Was it pastoral?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  A tremendous amount.  And bar mitzvahs.  And weddings.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  He was teaching students from the beginning.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, yes.  Weddings and funerals, and he used to write a speech every week, and we would type it out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2422.0,2437.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  A speech?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, you know, let’s say for this portion of the week, a child is bar mitzvahed, and you...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I understand.  But the cantor did that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, my father did it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What did the rabbi do?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He ate.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What was the name of the rabbi when Abba...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2437.0,2452.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Koblein.  Adolf Koblein.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And he ate?  He didn’t give sermons.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, he gave very lengthy sermons.  He’s still remembered at the seminary as...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So you’re, I don’t know, you’re about how old when you first were in Chizuk Amuno?  Eight?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2452.0,2470.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Eight?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Eight-and-a-half, nine?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.  They had a choir there from the beginning, your father’s first...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  My father did not bring it in ‑‑ they had their choir.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  They had no organ.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No organ.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And no women.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  And no women.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2470.0,2484.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  No women in the choir.  Did they have boys, or just adult men?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, of course.  I was one of the boyetz.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  All right.  How did that start?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What do you mean, how did...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I mean, did your father say, “Hugo, you’re gonna be singing with me for the holidays this year?”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2484.0,2497.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Harry Cooperstein, the cupala macher[?], a boy alto, used me.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So from the very beginning, that was... you were a boy alto.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I was a boy alto.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And the repertory, do you have any recollection, was it the same?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Sulzer, Lewandowski.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2497.0,2512.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Sorry.  (Inaudible)\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But mostly Central Europeans, not much...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Central Europeans.  No Eastern.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Not the itinerant kind of...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  No.  And but now, here...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  And Frankfurt was the big tradition.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2512.0,2527.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  But what kind of... describe the kind of community that Chizuk Amuno was the shul of?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Chizuk Amuno was the first community... it was a Conservative synagogue.  Not Orthodox, and not Reform.  And it was... it was the first place where ‑‑ Jews and Gentiles ‑‑ where Russian Jews and German Jews could... were part of the same congregation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2527.0,2555.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Because there was this tremendous difference ‑‑ Russian Jews were inferior, and they couldn’t get into, into some synagogues.  And the German Jews wouldn’t have the others.  Plus the fact that they were Reform...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2555.0,2570.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Yeah.  The German one, I remember, what was the name?  It’s still there ‑‑ still a big congregation there.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Where?  In Baltimore?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  In Baltimore.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, the big German...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  The big German Reform one.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ..is the so-called Madison Avenue Temple.  What it’s called now, I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2570.0,2582.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Har Sinai.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSEROTA:  Har Sinai.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That’s it, that’s it, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, that’s where I was Choir Conductor later.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Uh-huh.  Well, we gotta talk about that.  But I want to go back to the nitty-gritty of choral experience.  Repertoire-wise, it was largely Central... or all Central European.  I mean, things that were printed...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2582.0,2603.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  ...books and so forth.  Nothing from manuscript part books?  You never sang from the....\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, manusc-... but from printed stuff.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But sometimes it was cheaper to copy than to buy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, yes, also... one of the things that never occurred to me ‑‑ I mean, we always assumed that the part book thing was ‑- and it was, among some of the Eastern European choirs and those that emanated from those in New York ‑‑ that that part book thing was just to prevent anybody from stealing the music, ‘cause they’d be too lazy to get together four of... one of each voice, and copy to make a score.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2603.0,2639.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that’s true, but there is another reason, and I discovered that reason, which, when you stop to think of it, it’s so obvious.  With a repertoire like that, if you had... it’s heavy to hold it in a choir.  I mean, nobody ever....\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBut anyway, the, for example, you were an alto.  Now, when it came to something like... I don’t know if you have a recollection of Haven yakkir li efra’im.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2639.0,2658.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah, I sang that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You sing a solo there?  Or did they do Lewandowski’s?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, they did Lewandowski.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So you didn’t do the kind of boy alto solos that...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Not in that, no, but I did other things, like I did Min hametzar...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2658.0,2670.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But of Dunayevsky[?] or Sulzer, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Dunayevsky, no the Halevy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  No, but I mean the kind of boy alto solos that wouldn’t be in Halevy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, not show-offy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  The theatrical types of things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2670.0,2684.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, oh, no, no....\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That didn’t occur in your synagogue.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My father wouldn’t permit that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What were his musical standards?  What kind of... what did he do?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Pretty high.  Pretty high.  He had... he sang German Lieder, always.  He must have learnt those, obviously, in Vienna.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2684.0,2704.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Did he train the choir...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Did he train the choir...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Did my father train the choir?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...or, yeah.  Or he had a separate choir leader?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He had a choir leader, too, but he was there at all rehearsals, telling them what to do.  Yeah, he was a... he was an absolute tyrant with the choir.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2704.0,2719.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Now, of course, by that time you, as a boy alto, you read music already.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But the other... it wasn’t a requirement.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  They all read music.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh, they all did.  The other boys?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  All the boys read music.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  In a generic sense...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  How big was the choir?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  ...was this, was this similar... was the repertoire similar or identical to what your father had sung?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2719.0,2737.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  It’s the same, it’s a continual...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So it all continued.  And how many members were there in this...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  How big was the choir?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  ...choir?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My father would have eight men and six boys or so.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And do you remember, in the case, let’s say...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2737.0,2751.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Let me see, who were the men?  I know, I know the names – Kusetsky[?] and his brother...then three, four, then a couple of macher.  There must have been at least eight men every Shabbes.  And the boys.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Every Shabbes, the boys too.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And you only had three on a part?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t remember.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But something like that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Whether we had three on a part or…","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2751.0,2780.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  I don’t know if you remember this, but I’m always interested in the question of what you sang from.  In other words, you sang Sulzer, particularly with Sulzer...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Did you ever sing from the printed Sulzer book?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2780.0,2798.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Never.  It was always...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My father owned the first edition.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah, but I mean, even the subsequent edition.  So it was music that was re-copied by your father, probably.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Copied by hand?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Copied by hand.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Even though they were published compositions?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Were they rearranged at all?  Or were they sung as...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2798.0,2814.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Uh, sometimes they were rearranged, since they would make things for men’s voices that obviously had been written for a mixed chorus.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Now, the big question is where, if anywhere, is that music?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, my God.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Do you think it’s still in Chizuk Amuno?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2814.0,2831.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I don’t know.  I, I, I... as a matter of fact, when I went into the Army, I had been at Har Sinai, and I had written a tremendous amount of music.  I left Har Sinai, and was very angry to leave, because they didn’t guarantee my job back after the war.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2831.0,2853.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There was a big fight about things like people going off to the service and... would their jobs be guaranteed back?  They refused to guarantee my job back.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eI left, and I left all of my manuscripts at Har Sinai.  And there were lots of compositions that I...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2853.0,2869.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But they’re there now, probably.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  There now?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know where they are.  I’ve never... they’ve never been traced.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Have you ever tried?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But these are manuscripts of...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My pieces.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Compositions or arrangements?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Compositions.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Liturgic... for the service.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, for the temple.  For the temple.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  In other words, you’re talking about a whole body ‑‑ whether it’s a small body or a medium, it doesn’t matter...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2869.0,2890.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Small body.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But it doesn’t matter ‑‑ it’s more than two or three pieces.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Of liturgical settings, original liturgical settings...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That I wrote, yes...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That you wrote, before the war. And that you’ve never seen since.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Never seen since.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2890.0,2905.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e There’s a wonderful letter you wrote to your parents from Prague about conducting Traviata, and thinking, “Oh, God, I don’t know how I’m gonna do this.”  And they, oh, you started, you were terribly nervous, and you started to conduct, and you heard people applauding, and you thought, “Well, they don’t applaud the conductor in the pit, it’s too deep.”  And they were applauding you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2905.0,2927.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you kept playing, and you took a bow, and you said, “I felt as if I were repaying a great debt to you and Papa.”  Beautiful letter.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  But you were annoyed, because the applause was at the beginning of Act IV, which of course has the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And nothing had happened yet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2927.0,2942.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  ...has the very, very quiet opening.  Let’s go back to...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I want to ask you about the music, about the... because this is something you’ve never talked about ‑‑ to me, anyway.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eYou were composing even before the war ‑‑ for whatever reason ‑‑ I mean at Har Sinai, it wasn’t required that you compose, but you were doing it artistically, not that you were...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2942.0,2964.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  ...engaged to.  And you left there, and so forth.  I’m just curious ‑‑ why haven’t you ever ‑‑ just let’s assume that the pieces are nothing that you’d want to do anymore, or something.  But...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Why have I never looked that up?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2964.0,2977.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  ‘Cause I’m lazy.  I’ve lost the keys to my safe deposit box and can’t find them.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But that I can understand, so have I.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  We all do that.  Usually, we don’t...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I’ve often wondered why I never, never...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2977.0,2995.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Well, you can be sure that we’ll check it out very quickly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ...looked, looked, looked it up.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I think that’s the synagogue where Faith Gurney went to take the pulpit.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I think so.  It’s the major German... that’s the one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=2995.0,3010.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SAYLOR:  Could I ask a question?  At that synagogue, were these pieces you wrote meant to be performed like every week, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Every week.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYLOR:  So it wasn’t like...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  They were largely responsive, not anthems.  They were largely responsorial.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3010.0,3030.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  So they were small ‑‑ these were not great, big compositions...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, no, no, not big, no...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYLOR:  Not like psalm setting.  And was that SATB, that synagogue?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Har Sinai.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  The Chizuk Amuno didn’t obviously retain a choir, SATB, with boys, whatever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3030.0,3054.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  After the Second World War, no.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  How long did that go on?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  After the Second War, they still had their old choir until, until I got back from the State Department, and I had no job, and they offered me a job.  And my mother cried.  Her poor son, who had been a great diplomat and a warrior, was now reduced to being a choirmaster, for whom she had a little bit of contempt.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3054.0,3086.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJ. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I want you to know that I sang in the choir at Chizuk Amuno until 1959, and got paid a dollar and quarter a week for singing in that, so they... there was a paid, must have been a paid, choir.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3086.0,3098.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Oh, it was a paid choir, but you were the only boy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  I was the only boy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  The only boy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  I just hung out, cause Hugo and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But your voice ‑‑ it was an unmatured voice yet.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Absolutely.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So you had to sing as a soloist, then.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Never did a solo.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3098.0,3114.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  How could you fit in with the choir ‑‑ just sing an octave higher for the part, or something?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And they didn’t let me do it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  No, well they don’t have....  I wonder, actually...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  She sang in the choir very softly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  See, and stand behind the first tenor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But it had a... it wasn’t SATB, then.  By that time, it had to be a totally TTBB chorus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3114.0,3130.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Well, no, Friday night, there were women.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  There was a choir ‑‑ the whole chorus.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Friday night, we had a Choral Society ‑‑ we had 50 or 60 people.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  All right, now.  I wanted to ask you about the Choral Society.  That was a community thing, or also just a Chizuk Amuno?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3130.0,3146.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Mostly Chizuk Amuno, but anybody could come.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And that was a volunteer chorus?  And when did that start?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  About... I’m trying to think, when I did I leave the department?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I mean, it’s post-War and so on.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, sure.  ‘48...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3146.0,3161.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  This Chizuk Amuno Choral Society started post-War.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ‘48, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Did they sing primarily for Friday evenings?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Friday evenings.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Or did they do any concerts or community events?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, oh, concerts, too.  Oh, sure.  We went to Washington...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3161.0,3174.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  That’s what I mean.  So it was larger than just the congregation...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I mean it was kind of, would you say it was kind of a communal chorus in Baltimore, a communal Jewish chorus?  A community...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I wouldn’t say that.  No, it was Chizuk Amuno.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  They sang only liturgical music?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3174.0,3188.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Only things from the prayer book?  No Israeli music, or Palestinian, or Yiddish songs?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Well, when did you do things like Misses Solemnisen and Choral Masterpieces?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That as we were getting better, when I did the Bloch synagogue service, and the Mihaud synagogue service.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  With the Choral Society.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, with orchestras, and...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3188.0,3206.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  How many people were in that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, we had... there must have been 45 or 50 in the chorus.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And they came what, weekly?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Weekly ‑‑ every Thursday night.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Every Thursday night, you would come back from New York...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Come back from New York...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ...and go straight to the choral rehearsal.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ...on the train with Henry Cowell, and he would come to the choir rehearsal, and sit there with a yarmulke on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3206.0,3223.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Why?  Just to observe?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, he’s a friend of mine.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And these were all mostly members, would you say, of the Chizuk Amuno?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Mostly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  And other women picked up around the place.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, naturally, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  But by then...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3223.0,3238.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Did the choir sing... did the members of the choir sing in the Choral Society as well?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, they did.  They resented it, but they did.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  They had to, yeah.  They were the ringers?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And what happened on the High Holy Days?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, they sang the High Holy Days...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Just the men.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ...the Choral Society wasn’t there.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.  Of course.  And how long did that exist?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3238.0,3260.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t know.  I don’t know.  I’m very bad about these things.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did it last until you went to Penn State?  Or did it dissolve before you left Baltimore?  My memory is that it continued, but I may be wrong.  Because you were also conducting other choruses.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3260.0,3277.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah.  I don’t remember.  This is a terrible thing, but I have no memory of these things.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You said you went to Washington, for example, to sing.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  For what kind of occasion?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Baltimore Hebrew Congregation, I mean, Washington Hebrew Congregation, invited us ‑‑ Gerstenfeld.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh, so a kind of guest...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  A guest appearance.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3277.0,3295.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  For a service or a concert?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I think it was a concert.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That’s Berlinski’s synagogue, right?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Who?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Berlinski’s.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Berlinski’s synagogue.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  He wasn’t the organist then.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Was there ever any musical accompaniment at Chizuk Amuno?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  You mean instrumental?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3295.0,3310.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No.  Except for weddings and things.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ‘Cause you know, I made two recordings.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I was just about to ask you about that.  The two... which is the one that’s with the men’s chor-... they’re not both with just men’s chorus?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  The one with the men’s chorus was talked about.  That’s with Sholem...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Katz.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Katz.  Now how, how did he get into the picture?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3310.0,3332.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I don’t know, probably through Kurt Liszt.  Kurt, how I became involved with Kurt Liszt, I don’t know, except that he was a friend of Milton Feist.  And I had begun to make some kind of reputation, I suppose, because he called me and said, “And I will do a recording of this if you will do that.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3332.0,3362.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/170","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Oh.  Milton Feist ‑‑ ‘cause that’s a name that comes up frequently. And he, yeah, he used to go... he lived in the neighborhood, on the West Side, near the Seminary, didn’t he?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ‘Cause he used to go, I used to see him at 110th Street...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  To 107th Street.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But he used to go to the synagogue on 110th Street.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  110th Street, I mean.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.  Ramat Ora.  Now, how did you know him?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3362.0,3378.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/171","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Uh, I came back... well, I had achieved a certain amount of notoriety in the Army.  I mean, I conducted for the BBC and things like that.  And I don’t really recall what happened, but I got a letter from Mercury Music, saying that they had bought the two pieces which I had... which... I forget what the name of the first ‑‑ oh, Weiner Levant published of mine.  And when you’re in New York, come look me up.  And I did.  And we became friends.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3378.0,3424.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/172","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  In other words, Feist...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Shortly after that...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I never really knew to what extent it really was a serious firm, that publishing concern.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.  Oh, absolutely.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And it was called Mercury?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  It was called Mercury.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  He owned it, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He owned it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Was it a one-man operation, or...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3424.0,3440.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/173","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, it was a four-man operation ‑‑ he and his brothers.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And it really sold music?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Feist, Leo Feist, had huge popular music.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But in terms of Judaically-related things...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3440.0,3456.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/174","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Only the things that Milton brought in.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  All right, so back to the recording.  That was the men’s chorus, and by that time, there were no boys.  I mean, I’ve heard the recording ‑‑ there are no boys in the chorus.  There are no soprano-alto voices ‑‑ all TTBB.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3456.0,3476.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/175","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  And that was the repertoire that you used at Chizuk Amuno.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  And we did this letter, this record.  Okay?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And the other record?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, that was Choral Masterpieces, and that was just the Choral Society.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3476.0,3491.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/176","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  That’s the Choral Society.  ‘Cause that sounds like a professional chorus.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, no, it wasn’t.  Amateurs.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  No ringers?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  There may have been, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did you have ringers from Hilltop?  Were you doing Hilltop at the time, the Hilltop Opera House at the time you were doing that chorus?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, I was doing Hilltop at the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3491.0,3504.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/177","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I have ‑‑ and this is the memory of a tiny child ‑‑ I have a vague memory that maybe some of the singers came, were part of that recording ‑‑ and this is something, this is almost pre-verbal, so I’m not sure, but ‑‑ did you have them in it?  Do you remember that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3504.0,3524.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/178","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t remember.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  What was, Hilltop was a...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  An opera company.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  A summer thing?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Uh-huh.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Do you want to ‑‑ when did you start Hilltop?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  195-, 1949 or 1950.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3524.0,3540.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/179","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN: But the Choral Society lasted what, ten years or so?  For ten years or something like that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, ten, 12 years.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Now, are there any ‑‑ you did that recording with Barkin, Jack Barkin, am I correct?  How did he get involved?  Was that your...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My idea.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3540.0,3553.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/180","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Your idea.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Jack Barkin and one of the grad-, one of the early graduates of the Cantor’s Institute.  Whose father was also a hazzan.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  As a soloist?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I thought...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3553.0,3569.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/181","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Rafael Edgar.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh, yes.  Well, Ray, he was in the first class.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Jesus, I still get these names, these names come out of nowhere.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  He is in Indianapolis now, as a matter of fact.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Wherever he is.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.  But he was a bass, right?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Baritone.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Bass-baritone, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3569.0,3586.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/182","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  And I used him on the recording, much to my regret.  And discovered that he couldn’t sing, because he was so nervous.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And Barkin you knew personally, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, just, a cantor, he was in Washington.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3586.0,3603.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/183","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Oh, he had a position in Washington?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.  Sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I didn’t realize that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He was a beautiful singer.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And those are the two... those are the only two liturgical recordings you made until...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...until you did the Seminary one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3603.0,3616.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/184","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Why didn’t you use your father in your recordings?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I think he was... I don’t think he was up to it anymore.  Certainly not in the bigger pieces.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You mean vocally?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3616.0,3630.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/185","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, vocally.  And although I should have, I frequently had the feeling, later on, that he was hurt that I didn’t use him, and I probably should have used him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3630.0,3646.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/186","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Did they sing ‑‑ in addition to those two recordings, did you ever do any conducting, liturgical things, on radio broadcasts, or in live radio?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, I used to do radio.  We did radio broadcasting for the JTS.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3646.0,3660.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/187","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  That’s later.  But I mean in Baltimore.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, this was while I was in Baltimore.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh, really?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Sure.  I was at the Seminary in the early ‘50s, don’t forget.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And you did broadcast from, live from Baltimore, or taped?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, we used to come up here.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  With the choir?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3660.0,3675.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/188","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  We did several big shows with the choir.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And it was all liturgical.  Do you know where those are?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  For the Eternal Light?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So we have to check... there is somebody who collects Eternal Light things, yeah.  So what’d you do ‑‑ one or two pieces?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3675.0,3693.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/189","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Did you talk about it as well on those programs?  Did you discuss the hazzanut, or anything like that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Just conducting.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYLOR:  The, part of the practice at Chizuk Amuno was to do this repertory, this Central European repertory.  Romantic repertory, basically.  Then didn’t you also sort of have choral improvisations or improvised accompaniments that you’ve talked about?  I only know this from coming to seder here, when...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3693.0,3721.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/190","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, the recording that we’re talking about with the men, that was improvised.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYLOR:  You mean, the responses...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, the chorus, the choral part was not written out.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSaylor:  Right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The vocal, the melodic line was.  And the... but the accompaniment was improvised from beginning to end.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3721.0,3738.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/191","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SAYLOR:  And was this sort of just passed-on tradition, or did everybody just know what the chords were, and fill in...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, they were told if they didn’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You should hear how they were told.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  It sounds improvised.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, it’s what’s called the prepared improvisation.  But seriously.  I mean, there is, I imagine you did what we all do ‑‑ I mean, you made sure that they had a feel for how to...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3738.0,3772.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/192","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Exactly, yeah.  So they would know what the tonality was and so forth, to get a general...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Two, five or four.  I’d never use seven and six, ‘cause I didn’t have hands.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You were about eight or nine when you got to Baltimore.  But had you gone to any schools in New York or New Jersey during...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3772.0,3788.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/193","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I must have gone in New Jersey.  Yes, I did.  As a matter of fact, I went to school in the Bronx.  Because there was a special assembly, and everybody was told how wonderfully I spoke English in only about two weeks or something.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And you did pick up English pretty quickly?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Very quickly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3788.0,3804.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/194","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  And then you got to Baltimore...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  And then I went to school in Newark.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Second grade, probably?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Probably.  Yes, because when we came to Baltimore, I was put in Miss Lulawick’s third class, and I recited the ‑‑ what is it? ‑‑ “I pledge allegiance to the flag,” the American creed, and we went down to Washington, and the man who wrote that gave it to me.  And I, as an immigrant boy, read it out loud.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3804.0,3833.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/195","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  You achieved some fame as an immigrant boy, didn’t you, in Baltimore?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  How?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  But when I won the scholarship at Peabody, the headline was, “Immigrant Boy Wins Scholarship.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  How old were you at the time?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Eight.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And you started studying at Peabody...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3833.0,3851.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/196","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ...almost immediately after you came to Baltimore.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Almost immediately when we came to Baltimore.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And then, what can you recall of that public school education in Baltimore?  I mean, what interested you as a student in terms of literature or other things?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3851.0,3866.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/197","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t know.  I was a very good student.  Worked very hard.  Very smart.  Read a great deal.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  How would you describe your temperament as a student?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  I was not... I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Have you... your temperament hasn’t changed much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3866.0,3884.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/198","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Some people have referred to you as feisty or caustic ‑‑ I don’t know who.  But what were you like as a kid?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Same way, I’m sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did you have good friends growing up?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3884.0,3898.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I was a bit of a tyrant with my friends, yes.  I forced people to do things.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Such as?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, well.  To be religious.  Or to save stamps when I wanted stamps and they wanted something else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3898.0,3916.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  There’s a story about those Reform boys, what’s that story?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Two boys were Reform Jews, and I tried to convert Jewry, convert ‘em back.  So I made ‘em get down on their knees, and swear that they were going to become good, God-fearing...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3916.0,3933.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/201","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But what was the power that you had over them?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And they got down on their knees?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Hmm-mmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Were they your age?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Hmmm-mmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Back to the musical side, here, in Baltimore.  I guess the overall question I have is, did your parents either push music on you or the opposite?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3933.0,3954.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/202","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e There was never any question of pushing.  One studied music in my family.  Period.  And that’s what it was.  There was never any question ‑‑ do you want to take piano lessons?  No, it was just you take.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3954.0,3968.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My father made inquiries as to who the good teacher was, and of course, he was steered by the nice German-Jewish families, to hire Florette Gorfein to be my teacher.  And then my favorite story is there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3968.0,3985.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/204","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I had become enamored of opera by that point, and I came to a...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  How old were you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  I came to a piano lesson with the vocal score of Aida.  And she, Mrs. Gorfein, Miss Gorfein, looked and says, “What is this?”  And I said, “I’d like to play this opera.”  And she called my father and said, “Your son is crazy.  He wants to play Aida.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What did your father say?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=3985.0,4009.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/205","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So this is obviously before you ever really heard an opera.  Were you a decent pianist as a child?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I was very bad.  I was very quick, but I didn’t practice.  And I never achieved any real technical fluency.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4009.0,4026.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/206","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But the cello...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, cello, forget about the cello.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  How long did you play the cello?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  How long did I play the cello?  Six months.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So that was just a very temporary period.  And no other instrument?  Piano was it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4026.0,4039.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/207","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: when you came to Baltimore, you started studying piano again immediately.  You studied just piano, or did you study theory and composition?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I... first of all, it was just piano.  And then somebody suggested that I ought to study harmony.  So again, I went the regular route, through the regular social channels, the socially acceptable teachers.  I mean, this woman, Gorfein, was the sister-in-law... well, never mind.  She was a member of the Blaustein, the AMOCO Gas family, and so that was absolutely kosher, and very, very high class.  And the Van Lears.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4039.0,4086.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So when they began to look for a theory teacher for me, they didn’t send me to Gustav Strudley, who was the old theorist.  They sent me to Louis Cheslack, who was a young boy who was trying to become a composer.  And I studied harmony with him, and Mr. Cheslack’s two famous sayings is, when in 1928, I went to hear the Schubert C-Major Symphony, and I was just absolutely ecstatic, he looked at the scherzo and said, “All padding.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4086.0,4125.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Great musical mind.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s what I came away with.  And the worst thing is, that he said the same thing... oh, yes, the other big famous saying was, I brought him the Ravel (sings), what was the name of that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Oh, The Pavane?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4125.0,4149.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/210","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Pavane.  And he said, “Counterpoint is old hat.”  Those are the two things I remember from him.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Now, did you sense, as a student, when he said this about the Schubert...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Great teacher.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  ...that this guy was an idiot?  Or did you believe...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4149.0,4161.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/211","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I didn’t know what I know.  It wasn’t a question of sensing it.  I don’t think I questioned it enough.  But I mean, I knew I was terribly upset, because I thought the C-Major Symphony was a wonderful piece.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  I think you were right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What role did Abba play in your musical education?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4161.0,4179.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/212","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t know how to answer that.  He encouraged me.  He took me to lots of concerts.  Went to all the symphony concerts.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  He wanted to go himself, so he took you along.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, well, he took me.  We went together.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did you play together?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, we played duets until I obviously was very much better than he.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4179.0,4197.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/213","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  You mean you played two-handed, four-handed piano.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Four-handed piano.  His fingers became slightly gnarled, and he had no technique.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What about vocal?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, vocal technique was fine.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And did you accompany him?  Did you play stuff?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Always, always.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What did you play with him?  What did you accompany him?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4197.0,4216.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/214","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Whatever he sang, starting from Beethoven, Mozart, Haydn, Schubert, Mendelssohn, Brahms, Hugo Wolf, even Hugo Wolf.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did he sing arias from operas, as well as lieder?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4216.0,4233.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/215","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Sure.  Operas, I coached.  Well, there was a time there, he was going to become... they were gonna do an opera, and they were gonna do Cavalleria Rusticana, and I coached him through that whole thing ‑‑ I still know absolutely every word, in Italian.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4233.0,4251.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/216","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Who was going to do it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  My father was going to be touring, he was going to be Alfio.  Cook Kusetsky [?], the tenor from the choir, was gonna be Turiddu, and I don’t recall whether her name was Helen Brommel, was gonna be Santuzza.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4251.0,4268.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/217","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  So this was gonna be a synagogue production of Cavalleria.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And you say, it was gonna be, but it took place?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, it never took place.  The conservatives thought it was very wrong to do that in the synagogue.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4268.0,4282.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/218","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  At Chizuk Amuno?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You mean, they were gonna do it in the shul?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYLOR:  But I want to ask you about that, because this is very interesting, the difference.  You say the conservatives, meaning with a small c...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, yeah, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYLOR:  Felt that it was what?  Just inappropriate?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4282.0,4296.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/219","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYLOR:  Why?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Because a hazzan shouldn’t sing operas.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That was it?  It wasn’t because there’s the big Easter scene in that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, no.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  It wasn’t the opera itself.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, it was the fact that my father was going to be an opera singer again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4296.0,4312.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/220","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But was it because it was gonna be in the synagogue?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  It just... all of a sudden, canceled, and I was just devastated.  Because...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Were you going to conduct it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, I was going to conduct it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh, you were going to conduct.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Oh.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  From the piano, you would have conducted it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  How old were you?  Do you remember that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  About?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I can’t remember.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Had you gone to college yet?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4312.0,4331.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/221","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t think so.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So you were in high school?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And you had, that would have been your conducting debut.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, my conducting debut...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Of opera.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, of opera.  I don’t know.  I conducted in high school, and... I conducted the school orchestra in Baltimore, but they wouldn’t let me be conductor, because the conductor was a violinist, so I did the work, but I didn’t get the kudos.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4331.0,4358.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/222","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Where did you get... at that time, had you studied the basics of conducting?  Score reading...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I just knew how to conduct.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But you couldn’t really read the open score?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, I could read it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So who taught you that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Of course I did, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4358.0,4374.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/223","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  How did you learn that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  At the library.  Went to read a score.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Clefs, I mean, who taught you basic things like...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, it says so in the books about clefs, and I read it.  The first open score that I ever really worked at was the Mozart G-Minor Symphony.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4374.0,4393.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/224","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  So when it comes to the basic rudiments, I mean, such as score reading and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Do you know the first thing that I ever did for Fritz Reiner when he was auditioning us to become members of his conducting class?  The Rhenish Symphony of Schumann.  I heard it the other night, and I said to myself, “I can’t believe that I knew this piece when I was 17 years old.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4393.0,4423.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/225","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Let’s get you through these years.  Where did you go to high school?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Baltimore City College.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The home of five members of the National Academy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  As five members...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You mean American Academy.  Really?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Who were the others?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4423.0,4438.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/226","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Russell Baker, Carl Shapiro, Hugo Weisgall, who else, I mean, two others?  Two others.  That’s the only high school in the country that had... oh, yes.  The historian... Allan Bloom, and...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4438.0,4459.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/227","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  You’re just talking about ‑‑ just to clarify it ‑‑ you’re talking about the American Academy of Arts and Letters?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  As a high school boy, or junior high school and high school, did you ‑‑ I’m trying to get a sense of what you did as a student ‑‑ did you devote a lot of your time to music, or did you pursue other things?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4459.0,4479.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I pursued other things.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Such as?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, clubs ‑‑ I was a big Zionist.  Very pro-Israel.  I did a great deal of reading, I played around.  And Young Judea, and things like that.  I suppose I devoted a great deal of time to music.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4479.0,4504.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I know one thing ‑‑ I thought I did much better in high school than they thought, because when I graduated from high school, I got all dressed up, expecting to be given at least two awards.  And didn’t get one.  And that hurt me for a long time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4504.0,4522.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  What about your Americanization process here?  Were you interested in things like Boy Scouts?  What did your parents think about that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, my father didn’t believe in Boy Scouts ‑‑ it was militaristic.  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He wouldn’t permit it, no.  He also didn’t permit roller skating.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Why?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4522.0,4536.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  ‘Cause I’d break my neck.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, he’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So you didn’t break your neck.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You were never a great athlete?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I was never a great athlete, no.  I didn’t, I never played football, I could never hit a ball.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4536.0,4554.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/232","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  What sort of musical training... what did you do in high school with music?  There was this orchestra, you said?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I led the orchestra.  I trained them, they didn’t train me.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You really ‑‑ I know I keep coming back to this ‑‑ but you’re really telling us that as far as conducting up to that point, you were basically self-taught?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Absolutely self-taught.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4554.0,4570.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/233","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Did you think you wanted to be a musician, or did you assume you were going to be a musician?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I don’t know.  You know, I won the composition scholarship at Peabody.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  No, I didn’t know that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I did.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  When did you win that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4570.0,4582.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/234","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I did.  I won the composition scholarship at Peabody.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  When you were in high school.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  When I was in my last year in high school, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And you hadn’t had formal training in composition, either?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, not yet.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Whatever that means.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4582.0,4596.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/235","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I wrote a few, I wrote a few things.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What did you win it for?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I wrote an arrangement of a poem by Goethe called, I forget what the name of it is.  But kind of a crappy symphonic poem I wrote, and I won the scholarship with it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4596.0,4618.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Then I also, I had some very interesting, some very personal things about ‑‑ let me try to get one thing straight.  I wanted... I was obviously planning to be a composer.  Or a musician.  And I went to see the director of the Conservatory, Otto Ortman, about registering for the diploma, artist’s diploma.  And he took one look at me and he said, “Hugo, you have no talent.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4618.0,4647.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e As a composition student?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4647.0,4659.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/238","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, as a conducting student, ‘cause I no longer had any faith in myself as a composer.  I didn’t write for three or four years after that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  When did that event occur?  Was that after Hopkins?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, it was probably during.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4659.0,4674.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/239","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  During.  So you come, you graduate from high school...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  In ‘29.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  In ‘29, and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, one other thing.  The day that I won the harmony scholarship I was sitting in the hall of the Peabody, you know, feeling very proud of myself.  And a guy named Franz Bornschein, came up, a teacher, with a batch of keys, and jingled them and said, “What’s that tune, genius?”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4674.0,4701.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  They loved you.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I want to ask you something about your high school days, before we move on.  You tell us that you were very interested in Zionistically-orientated affairs, and so forth.  Now was that something ‑‑ first of all, was that something that your family was involved in?  Were they involved in Zionist organizations?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, my father was.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  They were.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Your father was?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4701.0,4725.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  It doesn’t go without saying, in those days.  Before the war.  Your father was involved in what?  American Zionist Organization?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, your Uncle Meyer was the big...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Sure.  Yeah, we were a big Zionist family.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4725.0,4740.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  You were a Zionist family, all right.  Now what about summers?  I mean, was there ever... you never did go as far as to go to any Zionist youth camps that existed pre-war?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, but I did go to a camp, but not until I became a cou-....  I didn’t go to camp until I was 16 or so.  But I was a counselor already.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4740.0,4754.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  A Zionist... a labor Zionist camp or any of those?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, it was a regular camp.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What’s... how did your mother feel about your studying composition and conducting?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I don’t know whether she ever thought about it too much.  The only thing is when I came back from the war, when I came back from the State Department, and told her that I was going to be a... I was going to spend my life being a composer, she said, “You’ll die in the poorhouse.”  My mother was... my mother was not very encouraging.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4754.0,4787.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/244","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  But to clarify here ‑‑ the conducting was after your undergraduate period at Hopkins, wasn’t it?  Your time at Curtis?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Absolutely, sure.  ‘Cause by ‘32, of course...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Sure.  Now when were you at Peabody?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4787.0,4802.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/245","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, for years, from about ‘26 on.  Studying piano and harmony.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you were in Peabody while you were still in high school...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.  And in Peabody while I went to college.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4802.0,4816.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  You must then tell... let’s get this story out of the way.  When did you get thrown out of Peabody?  What happened there?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I must have gotten out... it must have been ‘32, because the same year I entered Curtis.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  That’s when he said you have no talent.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.  And I left.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You left or you were thrown out?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4816.0,4832.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, I don’t know.  He wouldn’t... he refused to enroll me for the artist’s diploma.  Which I assumed was being thrown out.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And who was the he?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Otto Ortman.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Ortman.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4832.0,4845.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/248","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  You automatically went on to a university course.  I mean, it wasn’t a question of a conservatory degree or... you went to Hopkins.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Out of high school.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  What about it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Liberal arts?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That was automatic in your family?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  No, it wasn’t.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4845.0,4863.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/249","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I forgot something before.  At high school graduation, when I was absolutely devastated that I’d won neither the German nor the music prize, I went to, I went to enroll at Hopkins.  And lo and behold, I had very bad marks.  And they said that they... they said they wouldn’t admit me because I didn’t have a high enough average.  Which of course was murderous, and I was terribly upset.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4863.0,4897.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/250","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e That was a liberal arts... it wasn’t a music... you weren’t pursuing a music degree.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4897.0,4918.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/251","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e No, actually, at that point, I didn’t know what the hell... oh, I was majoring in history.  I wrote a paper on the history of the expulsion of the Angevin Jews from England in 1290.  I wrote a paper about that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4918.0,4935.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/252","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  You’ve portrayed yourself, though, as such a good student in high school, and yet, here you find yourself with lousy grades.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, well, obviously, I was wrong.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  But didn’t you know your grades as you were going along?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I probably didn’t look at ‘em, who knows?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So at Ho-...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Or perhaps I had the attitude, “they can’t do this to me.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4935.0,4955.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/253","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Talk about the Hopkins years.  What are your strongest memories?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, of my education?  Wonderful education.  Hopkins.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Who did you study with?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Everybody.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Who?  We don’t know who everybody are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4955.0,4970.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/254","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I mean, the great people in literature and in languages.  I studied French philology with Raymond Spitzer, and I studied Italian philology with Greenbaum, and French dramatic history with, what the hell was his name?  Louis Carrington something-or-other.  Arthur Lovejoy, for philosophy, George Floas for philosophy.  Albright for historical archaeology.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4970.0,4998.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/255","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And Mr. Albright, after the war, came up to me at Hopkins, and I was wearing, I was still in uniform.  He said, “Do you remember me lieutenant, I’m Professor Albright.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=4998.0,5014.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/256","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  You went to college in the fall of ‘29...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  ...which coincided with the big stock market crash and the onset of the Depression.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  How was your family able to send you to college?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I worked.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Doing what?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Library work, and other things.  I made up most of my tuition.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You paid yourself.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did you teach at all, were you teaching any...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5014.0,5036.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/257","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Were you still singing in the choir and being paid for that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, my voice had changed.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And you weren’t one of the men.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You were out of it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Out of it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did you go to services...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ...on Friday and Saturday?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Hmmm-mmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  How did your parents...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5036.0,5050.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/258","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  But by that time, I was already the choir leader at...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Har Sinai.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  At Har Sinai.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So while you were in college, you were the choir leader at Har Sinai?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But that was a very part-time position, their choir leader that just contributed a little.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.  Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5050.0,5067.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/259","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  How did your father feel about your academic career?  Was he pleased?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know what they thought.  You know, for a long time, they thought I was gonna be a doctor.  And then I was...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  A doctor?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  A doctor, yes.  You’ll never believe me.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You mean a real doctor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  A real doctor, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  A medical doctor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5067.0,5086.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I really don’t... I can’t remember whether I even thought about what I was gonna do with my life.  It’s probably just go along from one chorus to another, or something.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And the Phi Beta Kappa?  How did Abba feel?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5086.0,5098.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, my God!  Oh!  Two things:  I was composing in my... when I was about 16 or so.  And I wrote some songs and we heard about the Bearns Prize, which was available for young composers.  And I showed my father these songs.  He said, “Send them along,” to the prize.  Oh, it’s lousy stuff.  It’s not good enough.  I’m not gonna send it along.  And I had a big pitched battle.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5098.0,5135.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/262","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They were sent along to the Bearns Committee.  And one Saturday afternoon, I was at Hopkins, and I looked in my mailbox, and there was this letter telling me that I had won the Bearns Prize.  You know, with $900, which was a fantastic amount of money.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5135.0,5159.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/263","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you know, I went home, and my father almost died of delight.  \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eYou don’t remember the name Paul Cordish, do you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He was the one that came, walked to my father’s house to tell him that I’d made Phi Beta Kappa.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5159.0,5176.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/264","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  How did he find out?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know how he found out.  But those were the two high... that, the Bearns Prize and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What did you do with the money from the Bearns Prize?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  From Bearns, I went to Harvard.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  For summer school?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Summer school.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5176.0,5192.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/265","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  What’d you study there?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Poker?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  History, but I lost all my money.  I had to come home.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  How did you lose your money?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Gambling.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You, gambling?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What was your game of choice?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What was your game of choice?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Poker.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5192.0,5206.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/266","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  And you’ve probably never played it since.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  All the time.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  He plays every Saturday night.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  He’s trying to make up for it.  What did you study at Harvard?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  History.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  With whom did you study?  It was just in the summer school.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Who did you... what was your...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  But I know, I expected to go back in the fall.  But there was no money.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5206.0,5224.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/267","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Your big interest was history.  I mean, you didn’t take the money and go study music somewhere, or music history, even, or composition.  You went...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did you assume that you just were gonna learn music anyway?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  I don’t know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5224.0,5238.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/268","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  So you graduated as a history major.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I didn’t graduate, that’s why I went to graduate school.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  In?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  In history.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And what did you pursue?  What field?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5238.0,5250.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/269","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I mean, I was thrown out of the History Department.  I was writing a history of the Golden Legend, by Jacobus de Voragine.  And I was writing a dissertation on the saint cult.  And the Virgin Mary.  And I had a sentence in there in the Middle Ages, Christ was not worshipped, Mary was worshipped much more.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5250.0,5274.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/270","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And Professor Sidney Painter says, “How can you prove it?”  I said, “Well, just look around.  You see thousands, many more pictures of, many more symbols of the Virgin than of Jesus.”  Anyway, he wouldn’t accept it, so I had to go out, and leave the History Department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5274.0,5290.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/271","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I went into the German Department.  And wrote a dissertation on primitivism and related ideas.  In German, 17th century lyric poetry.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And that is where you got your... you got your Ph.D.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s where I got my Ph.D.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5290.0,5304.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/272","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: Was it in German or was it in...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, it was a combination of philosophy, history of ideas and German.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Why were you interested in the cults of the saints and the Virgin?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know, because I must... something fascinated me about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5304.0,5320.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/273","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  You don’t know what it was.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, no, something that I must have studied in school, history.  History always interested me.  A great deal.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You can’t relate the cult of the Virgin to...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I can’t.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ...to leading the choir in Har Sinai.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5320.0,5335.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/274","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, I can’t.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Oh, we’re gonna get Freudian again, now.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  No, not necessarily.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  When you say you didn’t graduate as an undergraduate...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t have an undergraduate degree.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You only have a doctorate.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5335.0,5347.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/275","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I have only a doctorate.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, what happened now?  Let’s talk about... Curtis was after that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.  Now, how did that come about?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, not necessarily.  Because how long did it take you to get your Ph.D.?  Three years?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Till 1940.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So you were at Curtis from 1932 on.  So you were doing...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5347.0,5365.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/276","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I was at Curtis from about ‘32 to ‘38.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  So you were doing both of them together.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You were overlapping.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Uh-huh.  While you were working on your dissertation...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You were... and Curtis was your, really the first, sounds like to me, that’s the first formal...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...musical education on the higher level.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5365.0,5380.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/277","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, no, that’s not so.  Because I had, I had heard of Roger Sessions.  In the ‘20s.  And I came to New York and wanted to study with him, and he took me on as a student.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Private student?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  When?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Approximately when?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5380.0,5397.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/278","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Approximately ‘33.  There were... there was Miriam Gideon, Vivian Fine, David Diamond, uh, uh, myself, and a big musical comedy guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5397.0,5413.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/279","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Not Morton Gould?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, not Morty.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Well, whoever.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Uh, Engel, Engel, Engel, Engel, Engel.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSEROTA:  Oh, of course.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you were about 20, 21, when Sessions took you on as a student?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, I was 21, 22, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5413.0,5428.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/280","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  So you were pursuing composition with him, but you went...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Conducting with Fritz Reiner.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Would you describe Reiner?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Describe Reiner ‑‑ what was he like?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Reiner?  Well, my favorite story is the first orchestra rehearsal that I was asked... we were... our class, the classes had to go to his rehearsals.  And this was the first time that any of us was supposed to... you had to play in the orchestra, but if you can’t play in the orchestra, what are you gonna do?  You play triangle.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5428.0,5464.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/281","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we were doing Capriccio Espagnol, and I was playing triangle.  And Reiner stopped the orchestra, and said, “Weisgall, you know any damn fool can conduct.  It takes a musician to play triangle.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5464.0,5491.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/282","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  You were really that bad?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You were that bad?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Your beat was still small, even then?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, terrible.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Because, you know, I mean, I got it to be, because everybody thought, in the last few years, it was gonna..\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  You know, all my life, I conducted that way, too.  Always.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, it worked.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5491.0,5508.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/283","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes.  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But you know, you know the true story about the bass player in Chicago Symphony who... with the telescope that you rehearsed with try to find your beat.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Yeah.  Did you develop any kind of a relationship with Reiner?  Were you a good student?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5508.0,5523.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  To tell the truth, no.  I would have lunch with him once a week.  But I pushed myself on him.  But I did, I had lunch with him, and we talked music.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Such as?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5523.0,5537.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, he was very much interested in Kodály at the time.  And we spoke about the Solemnis and Garicus.  And then we spoke a good deal about Bartôk in those days.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But you never spoke about synagogue music with him, did you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  I never spoke to him about my own compositions, either.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5537.0,5554.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/286","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Or anything related to synagogue music, cantorial... he wasn’t interested that your father was a cantor, nothing.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Not with Reiner, no.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  But in ‘30...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  He didn’t know who my father was.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  He was not a practicing Jew.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Who, Reiner?  Oh, definitely no.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  No.  He was Jewish, but...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  In ‘38, though, you went to study with Bartôk, didn’t you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5554.0,5573.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/287","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  That’s... no, I went to Europe.  But I didn’t study.  I went to see Bartôk, I never studied with him.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did you want to study with him?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, but he wasn’t accepting students.  As a matter of fact, Bartôk said to me, “Young man, there’s gonna be a war.  Better go home.”  Which I did.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5573.0,5592.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/288","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  And he came to the States.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  And then he came to the States.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And got poor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Back at Curtis, did you study with others?  Besides...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, not really.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, didn’t you do some classes with Scalero?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5592.0,5606.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/289","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, Scalero.  Oh, sure, composition.  Sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you studied...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I studied composition with him, too.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And both at Curtis and then in Italy briefly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  One summer.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Hmmm-mmm.  Yes.  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And didn’t you... weren’t you in Longine’s class?  Or didn’t she have...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5606.0,5623.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/290","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah, I took solfeggio with Longine.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  How did you do with her?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Pretty well.  I was never one of her big boys.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But you, I mean, she’s the one that they called “The Infamous Madame of Dictation,” at Juilliard, isn’t she?  Wasn’t that her title?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5623.0,5637.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/291","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  She was quite a good, sure, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLevin:  But she used to brag about the students that she flunked.  You weren’t one of those.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I don’t think I was.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  I’m kind of confused about this.  It sounds as if you were a part-timer at Curtis.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I didn’t live there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5637.0,5652.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Did you get a degree?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  In?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Composition and conducting.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  The diploma.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The diploma.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  It’s not a degree, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  It’s not a degree, no.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  In what year did you get that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ‘38, I think.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: How did the family fare during the Depression?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5652.0,5667.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Quite well.  My father’s salary was very drastically cut, and he took on extra work at the synagogue ‑‑ he became the Seating Chairman.  In other words, he had to go around and sell tickets for the High Holidays to, you know, to keep the synagogue going.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5667.0,5684.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJ. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Talk a little bit about your... about Freddy during these years.  What was he doing, and what was the nature of the relationship?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5684.0,5704.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I was seven years older than Freddy, and there was practically no relationship.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did he follow in your footsteps in any way?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, but he... no, but he... I was always held up as an example.  That must have been horrible for him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5704.0,5719.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Because he did not do...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Because he does not... didn’t get his name in the papers spelled right or wrong.  And didn’t win scholarships.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did he pursue music training?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, oh, yes.  He studied violin for years.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  As seriously as you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, he never learned how to play.  But yes, as seriously as I did.  He never learned how to play.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5719.0,5743.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Did he... was music as natural to him as it was to you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.  I don’t... yes, he was a terribly musical person.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yes, it was.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Terribly musical.  Sure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5743.0,5751.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/298","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e He was naturally extremely musical.  But he... Freddy always had a penchant for doing things crazily.  When we went back to Europe in 1926 to see... back to Ivančice, he came into my uncle’s house, and the first thing he did was run his head through the two glass windows.  You know, they had double windows.  And we hadn’t been there five minutes before we had that with Freddy ‑‑ he had to be taken to the hospital.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5751.0,5781.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/299","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  By the way, just coming off the war for a moment.  Your... your first trip back to Europe you’ve talked about, which was ‘26.  When was your next trip back to Europe?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  It was ‘33.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ‘33?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And you went where?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  With whom, to see what?  Any memories?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5781.0,5797.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/300","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, I’m wrong, ‘33 is wrong.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ‘38.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ‘38.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Ah, okay.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ‘37, ‘38.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did you go to Ivančice then?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I went to Vienna after the Anschluss.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You did?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5797.0,5811.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/301","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes.  And I was with my cousins.  And we went to the American Consulate together, and I said I wanted a visa for Czechoslovakia and Hungary. And the guy at the embassy, or I think it was a ministry at the time, said, “I don’t think that you ought to go to Czechoslovakia, because you were born there, and we have no reciprocal treaty.  So if they want to keep you, they will.”  So I did not go to Czechoslovakia, but I did go to Hungary.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5811.0,5843.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/302","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Did your cousins have any sense of urgency about getting out of Vienna?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5843.0,5860.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/303","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I don’t know.  No ‑‑ as a matter of fact, I think the most important thing was that my cousin, Ludwig, had just lost a daughter from strep throat.  And his wife ‑‑ his daughter and his wife within two weeks of each other.  And that probably so completely killed him that they just didn’t move.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5860.0,5880.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now why my family in Hungary didn’t get out, I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  When you saw them in ‘38, what did, what did they say?  What did you talk about?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know, it was just normal.  I got along very well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5880.0,5893.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  You didn’t say, “Maybe you should get out.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  What was, I mean this is a big topic, but I mean, in terms of your impressions of Vienna, post-Anschluss but still before ‘39, what was it like to you?  I mean, how did it strike you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5893.0,5914.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Horrendous.  I again, slightly rebelled.  I sat down on a bench and I don’t know whether it’s something ‑‑ Keine Juden or something, but I sat there, and my cousin said, “Get up.”  I said, “No.  I’m an American.  I don’t have to pay attention to this.”  Which of course legally, is all wrong ‑‑ you have to obey the rules of the country where you are.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBut I was, well, I was upset enough to come back.  I expected to stay in Italy all that year.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5914.0,5955.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  In... just staying with Vienna for a second.  You saw the German soldiers in uniform.  You saw the Nazis.  Are there other stories you can remember from that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And your cousin was just accepting the rule, saying this is the way it’s gonna be?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5955.0,5971.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/308","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah.  He was an old man ‑‑ he must have been 45 or 50 at the time.  He just accepted it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Was the main purpose of that trip to Europe to study?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The main purpose was Curtis sent me to Europe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5971.0,5986.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/309","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  You had a scholarship for the summer.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I had a scholarship.  They sent me to study with Scalero.  They actually called me up one evening, he says, “Do you want to study... do you want to go to Italy?”  I said, “Sure.”  “You want to study with Scalero?”  I said, “But you know I’m a conducting student.”  They said, “We know.  You compose anyway.  Why don’t you study with Scalero?”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=5986.0,6003.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/310","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Great.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  So I did.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  In what city?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Settimo Tavagnasco.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Which is where?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Twenty kilometers from Ivrea, in the Valdos.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6003.0,6016.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/311","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  And what was the experience like, with Scalero?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, it was nice.  I had a good time that winter, that summer.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What did you compose?  Do you remember?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, lots of motets.  And...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Were they assignments, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I just chose to do motets.  And that did that fugato ‑‑ bam, bam, bam... (singing).  You know, which is Opus Two.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6016.0,6040.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/312","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  From the ballet.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  From the ballet, One Thing is Certain.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What was Opus One?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Four Songs.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  But that came later.  That was in the war.  Oh, no, that was Soldier Songs, right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWhat was Scalero like as a teacher?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6040.0,6053.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/313","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e You reminded me of the Stravinsky story.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eI don’t know.  He was a nice guy.  I was rather amused ‑‑ after taking counterpoint exercises which I had written years before and he thought he corrected them, but they had already been corrected, and he didn’t know.  He wasn’t interested in teaching.  He wasn’t interested in teaching me.  He had to have Menotti and Sam Barber and Constance Volclay, and he didn’t need me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6053.0,6083.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Tell the Stravinsky story.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, the Stravinsky story.  I met Stravinsky, said, “You know Mr. Hindemith?”  And, “Yes, I know Mr. Hindemith.  Oh, he’s a very nice man.”  “What do you think of him as a composer?”  “I don’t think of him as a composer.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6083.0,6091.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Great story.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What’d you do from... okay, you’re back and then ‘38, you’re kind of done with studies.  What exactly happened between ‘38 and the outbreak of the war?  What did you do with yourself?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6091.0,6112.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Were you still studying with Sessions then?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I was still studying with Sessions.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And you were still... you didn’t get your Ph.D. until 1940...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ...so you were probably writing about primitivism in German poetry.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6112.0,6126.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  And... when were you at Camp Airy?  Was it then?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  From about 19-... from about 19-, I don’t know, it was an awfully long time ‑‑ ten, 12 years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6126.0,6142.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/318","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  And that’s when you first conducted operetta in a serious way, isn’t it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s when I got into the Gilbert \u0026 Sullivan business.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  With campers.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  With campers?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  With campers, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What were those productions like?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6142.0,6157.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/319","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, they were lots of fun.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What did you do?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I think I... we did, first thing, Pinafore, Pirates of Penzance, Ruddigore, Mikado, The Yeoman of the Guard.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6157.0,6174.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/320","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  But what was your role ‑‑ what did you do?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I was director and frequently participant in...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Weren’t you the star?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  In Yeoman of the Guard, I sang...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  I have a song to sing.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Jack Point.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Jack Point.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  In costume and everything, you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6174.0,6188.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/321","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes, and this tremendous applause, and I got up and took ‑‑ after I died, I got up and took a bow ‑‑ and died again.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And you liked that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You appreciated the music?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, I loved the music ‑‑ I still do, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6188.0,6205.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/322","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Didn’t you do some Gilbert \u0026 Sullivan in, at Hopkins?  Well, you did theatre at Hopkins, didn’t you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, at Hopkins, I did.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Weren’t you...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, I forgot that we also did Patience.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I did practically all of those operas ‑‑ the only thing we didn’t do was Iolanthe or Princess Ida.  Oh, we also did Gondoliers. My God, I didn’t know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6205.0,6227.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/323","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  You did Patience at Hilltop, too, didn’t you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I did Patience at Hilltop.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  I remember seeing it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You didn’t appear in that.  You didn’t sing in that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Back to acting again, though.  At Hopkins, I thought you were in a Strindberg play.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I was.  I was the Father, I was the Father in The Father, Strindberg’s Father.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6227.0,6244.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/324","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Was this part of other acting that you...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I was just an actor.  And I was so good that when they reviewed the play, they didn’t mention me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6244.0,6257.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/325","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e You grew up in a very close-knit Jewish community, with the synagogue clearly the center of your father’s life and probably yours, too.  But you wrote your dissertation on the cult of the saints and the cult of the Virgin.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6257.0,6272.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/326","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Your music has also been largely... your achievements have been secular.  How did you... how did that affect you ‑‑ growing up, going to public school, going to Hopkins?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eHow did you see yourself ‑‑ always as Jewish, moving in this alien world, wanting to be part of it, wanting not to be?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6272.0,6293.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/327","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, that’s a long, complicated question.  There was never any question of the fact that I was Jewish.  The degree to which that colors my life has probably changed over the course of the years.  But I think the line has consistently been that I don’t feel a conflict between my Jewishness and anything else, that’s the point.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6293.0,6324.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/328","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was always able to function Jewishly in my own way, without ever feeling any conflict.  I don’t... though I sometimes used to laugh and say, “Gee I were wish I were part of the majority,” but I knew perfectly well that I didn’t mean that.  But I... there is no conflict.  That I feel, that I am aware of.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6324.0,6351.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/329","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, I do find it strange that I perhaps am not written more Jewish works, the way so many of my colleagues have.  But I just haven’t.  I haven’t written that many works.  And if someone asks me, “What are your Jewish works?”  And I say, “Well practically everything I do is Jewish, because I’m ipso facto Jewish.”  That’s all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6351.0,6376.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/330","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It’s nothing else I think about.  I’ve never had a quarrel with it, I’ve never blamed my lack of success or misfortune on the fact that I was Jewish.  I just never have.  It’s never bothered me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6376.0,6389.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/331","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  So it was not... it was just there ‑‑ it was a source of...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  It was there. It’s like my feet being 9 1/2, and being slightly bald ‑‑ I’m Jewish.  Period.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: I found this letter last night, talking about your going to services in England.  “Here in the midst of a strange city, and in the midst of a strange people, these memories have very little to which to cling.  It was all as if I had gone to see a play in a strange language.  I knew what was going on in the stage, but I did not understand the words.  I suppose that I can...” ‑‑ this is Rosh Hashanah and Kol Nidre ‑‑ “I suppose that I can associate them only with you, my family, and the surroundings I know.  And with the customs which by repetition have become sanctified in my inner self.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6389.0,6443.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/332","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Good letter.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What am I really saying there?  What is the nature of my connection with...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6443.0,6461.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/333","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e That is one of the most difficult things to try to enunciate.  And it takes... it would take a great deal of thought.  And a great deal of concentration, to come up with anything sensible.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eNow, certainly, I am not what is normally called an observant Jew.  I am, however, a very committed Jew, and I find that a great strength.  And a great... a large source of that which I do as a human being is that Jewishness.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6461.0,6486.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/334","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, what it is besides tradition, tolerance?  It’s a commitment, it’s an acceptance of 5,000 years of Jewish history that I have voluntarily taken upon myself, and which I feel.  That’s all it is, but that doesn’t mean that....","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6486.0,6509.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/335","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Is it theatrical?  No.  I hope that my Jewish works are theatrical, I’d hate for them not to be.  But is it personally, is that a theatrical thing?  Eh.  I suppose, just as most things that one does on a regular basis, to which one is connected, are theatrical.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6509.0,6533.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/336","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don’t know what that means, really.  That it’s theatrical.  No, I don’t stand up... I can’t stand up in front of a people and point to myself as being terribly Jewish.  I do cry at the Holocaust, but I’m sure... the Holocaust is, after all, dealing with the death of the people that I know, the Jews.  I can’t quite say that I feel the same way about the people from Rwanda, although God knows on a human element, I should.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6533.0,6571.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/337","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  I meant more in a particular connection.  Because...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What do you mean?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, in this letter, you were saying that you’re moved... is it homesickness, or is it... it’s something that I feel, too.  You say later on, “I am never going to be away for the holidays again.”  And when the War was over, I don’t think you missed a Rosh Hashanah in Baltimore until, in the mid- to late ‘70s.  You were always there.  What is that?  What was that particular...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6571.0,6608.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/338","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e It’s the homing instinct.  It’s the homing... the homing instinct, which I have.  Which I didn’t adopt, which I just have, that’s all there is to it.  Now, I don’t know what it would be like if I were for instance to go to shul in Rockland, Maine, and not daven.  Or if I were to go to... if I were... had to go to a sonic synagogue out here, how much there would be left of that feeling.  I have no idea.  I don’t think too much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6608.0,6640.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/339","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  I don’t think too much, either.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I don’t think too much would be left.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: We’ve explored three major aspects of influences on your life – a Jewish one, a European one, and an American one.  How do you rank those three, in terms of identifying yourself and your work?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6640.0,6666.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/340","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, many years ago, I made up an identity dog tag.  I’m a Jew of the 20th century, living in America.  And that’s the... those are the... that’s the order in which I would place them today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6666.0,6687.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/341","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  That implies a certain rootlessness.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yup, I’m afraid it does.  But I just can’t... I’d just be rooted as a human being in free space.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  But you just talked about a homing instinct.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6687.0,6700.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah, well, all right, I have a homing instinct in free, in free space, where I find others who are equally homeless.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: One influence that we haven’t talked about that I think is something that is important through your whole life, is you have very strong notions of quality and of an idea of high culture, which is not particularly...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Which is what?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6700.0,6730.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/343","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Which is not particularly American.  It seems that you identify with a tradition, an intellectual tradition, a kind of intellectual rigor and certainly quality.  Would that be... has that gotten you into trouble?  Has that been a source of strength?  Is that something... is that a way you would identify yourself more readily?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6730.0,6762.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/344","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  High culture?  Yes, I’m a great believer in high culture.  I’m not at all a... what’s the new word?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Populist.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Not only a populist...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Multicultural?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Multicultural.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I am not multicultural.  It’s not that I don’t want to be, I just can’t understand it.  And I’m not going to break my neck trying to understand, because I have enough difficulty in understanding what it is I know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6762.0,6784.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/345","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN: You once said to me, and three or four of us at the Seminary, somebody has asked you, “What is... how do you define Jewish music?”  And I mean, it was in reference to somebody’s opera, and so forth.  And you said, “Well, first of all, it has to be good music.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  What do you mean by that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6784.0,6804.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/346","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.  Yeah, well, it’s the kind of a stupid thing that I... I once wrote an article, when I was in my very early teens, saying that for music to be Jewish, it has to be good.  My standards of what I consider good music, standards to which I adhere ‑‑ but I don’t know how carefully or closely or how logically I could defend what they are.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6804.0,6823.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/347","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But there is certain... there’s a certain quality that I feel about certain music which makes it good or bad.  And that’s all there is to it.  It’s terribly personal, and there’s nothing I can do about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6823.0,6837.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/348","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Listening to the... listening to the Rhenish Symphony the other night, I was struck by the fact how wonderful the first and second movements are, how downhill the third goes, and how absolutely awful the fourth is.  And it’s just bad music, and I’m surprised that Schumann couldn’t look at it and say, “It’s awful.  This is boring.  Doesn’t hang together.”  Well, that... now, I’m sure if I were to say that out loud, I’d be jumped on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6837.0,6870.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/349","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJ. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Let me come back to this point about this identity, with Europe, Judaism and America.  Your answer that you gave, of being a Jew in the 20th century, living in America, would more or less put Jew first, America second, Europe third.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6870.0,6887.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/350","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  That was clever ‑‑ how’d you find that out?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Well, I just did the math.  Um, let’s ‑‑ and I don’t want to... it’s a big topic, but let me point out that of your ten operas, none is based on an American subject at all.  There certainly are Jewish themes with Othalia and Esther, but really as a work, as an oeuvre, it’s as based in a European tradition as one could be.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6887.0,6920.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/351","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Several questions.  Number one, what does... what does that... what is your reaction to that observation, and number two... well, answer that first, and then I’ll follow up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6920.0,6932.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/352","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e The first thing about opera.  Opera has to appeal to me in a certain gut version, on a certain basis that has to have, that has to have certain qualities that I want to write.  And whether a libretto is Chinese or Greek doesn’t really matter.  That there doesn’t happen to be any American is just an accident.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6932.0,6954.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/353","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Japanese.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6954.0,6975.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/354","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Or that he was homosexual, and committed hari kiri, or whatever.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  It seems much more of a modernist tradition, than anything else.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I think the modernist tradition is very important, yes.  I think that’s quite important.  I’ve considered myself a modernist without actually saying so, but the next time anybody asks me if I do, I’ll tell ‘em that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6975.0,6999.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/355","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Would you define that for me?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?  I mean, it’s not romantic.  Romantic in the traditional nineteenth-century sense of the word.  It takes into account what has gone on in the 20th century ‑‑ the violence, the hatred, the extremes of passion which are so much of a part of contemporary literature. That’s modernism for me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=6999.0,7031.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/356","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e My libretti have been fairly extreme. The tenor has this insane quality of a man killing... of a man killing his mistress or of the man’s mistress dying.  Then he steps over her and goes out.  Now that’s one bit of violence that occurs only at the end, but it does color the whole work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7031.0,7049.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/357","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Same thing is true with The Stronger, whereby my librettist having made Estelle into drinking too much, she does one violent thing, and sets the tone of the opera.  And that’s true of every one of the operas ‑‑ there’s always something extremely violent that happens, which throws it from point A to point B.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7049.0,7078.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now what it is in Jenny, I don’t quite know.  And I really want to see Jenny again on the stage, and try to, try to experience it, so that I can better talk about it, or think about it ‑‑ become clearer in my own head about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7078.0,7099.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"By the way, that’s one of the great problems that I have as a composer, and that most opera composers, those of us, the less unfortunate, the less fortunate breed, have to put up with.  We don’t see our works well enough so that we are in a position to be able to judge ourselves, what it is that we’ve done, so that you can either do it again or avoid doing it, if that be the occasion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7099.0,7127.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"To this day, I don’t understand what happens in Esther.  I see absolutely no reason why that got the kind... that had the kind of response it had.  Many other operas I’ve written are just the same.  It’s not that it’s better or that it’s Jewish or that it’s this or that it’s that ‑‑ I just don’t know what happened, there are things that I don’t understand.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7127.0,7150.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Maybe it happened at the right moment.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Maybe it did, maybe it was what some other people said, everybody, they’ve caught up with you.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Exactly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, that’s possible.  That’s why I probably think that they should live so long before they catch up with me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7150.0,7168.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Would this be a good time to... let’s move right into World War II, and try to work on some of this chronologically.  What got you into the Army?\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Uncle Sam.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Were you drafted?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  13072747.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7168.0,7185.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/363","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Was?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s my Army serial number.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Okay.  How did... what were the circumstances that got you into the Army?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, you know, we were getting to the point where we, where there was a draft on, and people were going to go, so I thought I’d rather join than be drafted ‑‑ very simple.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Hmmm-mmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You knew you’d be drafted?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7185.0,7202.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/364","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, but I assumed I would be.  Why not ‑‑ I was in perfectly good health, and strong and everything else.  Why shouldn’t I go to the Army?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you enlisted...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And where did you go?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7202.0,7215.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I enlisted, and I went to Fort Meade, where I made the greatest mistake of my life, when the corporal said, “All college graduates raise your hand.”  And the next thing I knew, I was on KP for several weeks.  In fact, it wasn’t too bad.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7215.0,7234.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Describe briefly what you did in the Army before you ended up going over to Europe.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I was an enlisted man, I was at Fort Meade, the reception center, I don’t know how long ‑‑ three, four days, maybe.  Utterly miserable.  But since Meade was close enough to Baltimore, I was able to get off, and go home and see what life was like outside.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7234.0,7259.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then, it came... then there was... some kind of thing on somebody’s desk saying somebody who would know me, saying that I was a Ph.D., and that I should be... I was a candidate for the Office... the Intelligence Officers’ School.  And I was shipped off to Camp Ritchie, which was a training school for military intelligence, modeled after the British military intelligence school.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7259.0,7291.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I arrived at Ritchie, and I was immediately made telephone operator, which I can... still, to this day, don’t understand how I ever managed to do the telephone, but I did.  And I was in military intelligence training.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7291.0,7309.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  You followed in your father’s footsteps with the telephone.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes, yes, I never thought of that.  Except that I didn’t fall asleep.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  When had you met mother, Nathalie?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  About 1937.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7309.0,7327.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Before you went to Europe on that trip?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Under what circumstances did you meet?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  She was in Sunday school ‑‑ I taught Sunday school.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  At Har Sinai.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  At Har Sinai.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you not only conducted the choir, but you taught.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What did you teach?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7327.0,7340.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t know ‑‑ singing.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So you...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You taught her singing in Sunday school?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know, I taught singing ‑‑ the class, I didn’t do.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Oh.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you were dating her at the time you went into the Army and were assigned.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, you got married...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Not until late ‘42.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Oh, not, that’s right, that’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Late ‘42.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7340.0,7358.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  But you were serious about her by the time the war broke out, certainly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Okay.  We went back to Camp Ritchie not too long ago.  Do you remember meeting that old lady there?  Tell that...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  She died.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7358.0,7374.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Tell that story.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What’s the story?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  It was a Mrs....\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Mrs. Smith, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Smith.  Who was she, what did...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  She was the wife of the man who ran the camp, the chief gardener, or whoever was it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You mean Camp Airy or Camp Ritchie?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Camp Ritchie.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  At Camp Ritchie.  Old.  So then you... okay, let’s move this along, then.  When did you get married?  Tell that story of fitting that into your Army life.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Not... how what?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7374.0,7409.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Of fitting that into the fact that you were in the Army.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I got a three-day pass, and decided to get married.  And...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did Nathalie have any idea that you had decided to get married?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, I think so.  We talked about it, and she actually went out and got the licenses, and did everything else, as usual.  She did all the nitty, dirty details.  I just came in for the kill, to get married.  It’s true ‑‑ I had my time, waiting to see whether her father would arrive, which gave me kind of stomach aches before he did.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7409.0,7439.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We got married, and we were... we went out to get our luggage, to find that my... to find that Uncle Ray had run away with the... had taken our baggage, so we had nothing ‑‑ couldn’t even go to a hotel.  Then we finally went to a hotel, and then, I think people looked at us a little suspiciously.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7439.0,7460.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the next day, there was a telegram ‑‑ “The Army needs you desperately.  The War effort is going to hell.”  And I had to go back.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Who sent the telegram?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t... the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Freddy.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, no, no, no, it was an official telegram.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Who married you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7460.0,7475.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Seven rabbis, as far as I know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  How long did it take to get seven rabbis together?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Not very long ‑‑ it was a very short wedding, and each person was allowed a half a minute.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7475.0,7485.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  How soon after you got married did you get shipped off to Europe?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Four months.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What was that trip like, over to Europe?  How did you go?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  We went by, we were in a huge convoy, and we were the last boat on the left side of the convoy, which was called Dead Man’s Corner.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Because?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7485.0,7505.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Because that’s... submarines would pick off the last boat, because it was the most difficult to see from elsewhere.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Was there any combat?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, we ran into a number of German fleets, and we had actual combat.  We managed to not sink, but depth-charge the German submarines, and they came out of the hold, and we shot them down as they climbed out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7505.0,7536.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Were you one of the shooters?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I was not, but I was the one that gave everyone courage.  I said, “Kill the bastards!  Break up!”  I was in charge of loading the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Machines?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7536.0,7549.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e The machine guns.  It was a very strange trip.  Two or three nights before, we... there was this whole boatload of soldiers, and there was only one commanding officer.  And he was a little Jewish doctor, who knew as much about commanding boats as I did.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7549.0,7574.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we went around, examining the life boats.  And we discovered that none of the life boats had materiel in it, except the one for the crew.  Which obviously meant that if something had happened to us, they would have gone on, and let us go to hell.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7574.0,7592.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Horrible story.  It was a mixed crew, of all different nationalities.  Terrible people.  But there four of us, four of us enlisted men were actually in command ‑‑ Peter Elder, Jimmy Heineman, and what’s-his-name ‑‑ Deneer Garr, and I.  And the most that we were ‑‑ I think we were either Staff Sergeants or Tech Sergeants, I don’t know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7592.0,7624.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then, we had general quarters, but we managed to sink the submarines.  And we went on.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  There...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  But, the pic... I’m told that I was an absolute wild man.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7624.0,7640.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  During...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  During this combat.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  this combat, really.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Who told you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I was absolutely wild.  Huh?  I don’t know who it was who told me ‑‑ of course I didn’t believe it.  Which leaves me to think that it was Peter Elder, who made the story up.  But...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7640.0,7658.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  What was your basic function in the Army when you were in... you got to England...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  ...and then you were stationed in England for almost the entire war?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yep.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What was your job?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7658.0,7670.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I was... for instance, as an enlisted man, I was simply a part of the personnel of the, of the Intelligence Department of the Governments-in-Exile.  Then, when I was commissioned, I was an intelligence officer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7670.0,7689.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Who did you work for as an enlisted man and as an intelligence officer?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What do you mean who?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Which government?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, all.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  All of them?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And then...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I functioned for all of them.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And when you were commissioned, what kind of intelligence did you deal with?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7689.0,7705.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, I went around gathering up everybody’s stories, which were either true or not true.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Whose stories?  What kind...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, for instance, when I had lunch with the Queen of Belgium, and she told me all about her son, and how he really wasn’t a Nazi, and was not a collaborator.  But some difficult circumstances ‑‑ she would tell me that story.  I would go back to my office and send a cable to the Department, telling them that.  That’s the kind of intelligence.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7705.0,7733.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e How did you manage to have lunch with the Queen of Belgium?  You called her up and said...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7733.0,7748.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I said, “Yes, madame.”  No, that was through my friend, Jimmy Heineman, and his father, who was a great friend of the Queen’s.  She was interested in music, and I was his, I was, patron?  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Protégé?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7748.0,7762.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I was his protégé.  And I got to have lunch with her.  And she came to my concerts.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Didn’t you conduct there?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Like I said, she came to my concerts.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And you considered actually moving to Belgium, and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7762.0,7778.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  After the war?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.  I was... I say, and when I say that, I sometimes wonder whether I’m telling the truth, that I was offered La Monet.  I don’t know whether I was or not ‑‑ I certainly could have conducted there as much as I wanted to.  But I...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7778.0,7792.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/394","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Were you... oh, go ahead, finish.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?  Let me finish.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Uh, but I just really felt that I could not stay away, away from the United States.  And just wanted to come back and make my career here ‑‑ I did not want to make my career in Europe, neither as a conductor nor anything else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7792.0,7811.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/395","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I was asked whether I wanted to go into the radio business, and I could have had a big job as one of the, one of the controllers of the German radio.  But I didn’t accept that, either.  I couldn’t figure staying in Germany.  So when, when the embassy closed us down, I came back home.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7811.0,7852.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Closed you down where?  In Prague?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Prague.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You conducted... all your letters from England seem to say that you worked hard, partied a lot, wrote a lot of music, and conducted a lot.  How did you conduct in London?  What was...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7852.0,7872.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  If I had been given an engagement.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  But how did you get them?  How did you meet the people?  What happened?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I told a friend of mine, “If you’ve got an agent, get me a concert.”  Just the way you get jobs anywhere else.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Who were some of the people you conducted during the war?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7872.0,7887.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Myra Hess, among others.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  In what?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  In Beethoven’s Concerto, fourth Piano Concerto.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  With which orchestra?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The London Symphony, I think.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Who else?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7887.0,7900.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, you mean, other soloists?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Maura Limpaney, and that woman ‑‑ Eda Kersey, who died the day after the concert, and then someone says, “It’s because of the tempi that you took.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What’d you play?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7900.0,7915.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  It was the Bloch Violin Concerto. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  What about Paul Robeson?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Paul Robeson ‑‑ well that was with the United States Army Negro Chorus.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You conducted them?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7915.0,7933.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes.  I was conducting... I was the commanding officer of the outfit.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did you do a lot of... go ahead, Bruce.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYLOR:  With whom did you do the Britten Serenade?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  With the... well, I did it, I did it in London, and also in Prague.  In London, I did it with the people who’d been playing at Wigmore Hall a great deal ‑‑ Dennis Rain was the horn player.  And in Prague, I did it again, with uh, I can’t think of the name of the guy any more, but that was one of my more successful things, to do the Britten Serenade.  It was only the second performance.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7933.0,7970.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SAYLOR:  Didn’t you do some pieces of Vaughan Williams’, as well?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I did the fifth... I did the first European performances of Vaughan Williams’ Fifth Symphony.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You also championed American music.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7970.0,7983.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I certainly did.  I played a great deal ‑‑ I played Schuman, I played Piston, Paul Creston, of all people, Norman Dello Joio, whom else?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7983.0,7996.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Copeland?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Sessions.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.  Roger, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And you had one concert... what about the concert with Mark Blitzstein?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That concert... that was the one that Eda Kersey played Bloch with, I think.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And what did Blitzstein do?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=7996.0,8010.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  He played the piano and did Rhapsody in Blue.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Was he a good pianist?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, a very good pianist.  That’s the time that I fell asleep during the long cadenza.  That’s...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Tell that story.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8010.0,8022.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/406","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I was very, very tired, and I was conducting, and this long cadenza, and I stood there, and must have fallen asleep, because the orchestra came up with a bang, and I had to pick up on their time and go on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8022.0,8037.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/407","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  You also met with ‑‑ met and danced with the young Princess Margaret?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.  No, no, Elizabeth.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Yes, Elizabeth.  What were those circumstances?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Churchill Club.  That was an elitist club.  You were not... it was for, it was for non-English people, but you had to have something special to be asked to join.  And it was for overseas people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8037.0,8061.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/408","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  And what did you have?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What did you have?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I was a composer, and a conductor, and whatever else I was.  And I was asked to join.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8061.0,8075.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/409","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Those were the days ‑‑ you know, everybody mixed ‑‑ I mean, it was a fantastic society, London during the war ‑‑ Stephen Spender, W.H. Auden, Britten, whoever you had ‑‑ C.S. Lewis, everybody.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8075.0,8093.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/410","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Did you meet all of those people during the war?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.  Most of them, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Hmmm-mmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Didn’t you do something with the Princess Elizabeth?  Didn’t you insist on kissing her hand or something?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That was the Queen Elizabeth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8093.0,8106.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/411","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Oh.  Oh.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Tell that story.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I was leaving, and backing out, and she gave me her hand, like it was... turned to me like that, to kiss it.  Practically broke off her wrist, but...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You’d learned a lesson from your grandfather, though ‑‑ kiss the hand.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8106.0,8122.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/412","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes, I did, I did kiss her hand.  And I walked out backwards and knocked something down.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did you actually dance with the Princess Elizabeth?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  How was your dancing?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t... oh, wonderful.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eAnd talking about knocking something down, when I graduated from Curtis, same thing happened ‑‑ I went to get my diploma, and walked back, and knocked down two or three chairs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8122.0,8145.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/413","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Did you ever meet Churchill during the war?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You saw him in several settings?  Or Eisenhower?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Hmm-mmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Tell the story of being the ADC, the aide-de-camp for Patton.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8145.0,8158.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/414","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, Patton came to Eastern Europe to visit, to see what he had not done.  And they... Patton needed help, I’m an ADC.  He’s entitled to one, so they put me on.  And again, probably because I was supposedly well-educated and things, and we went... I took him places.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8158.0,8184.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/415","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we went up in the castle, and I said, “Here are what we call the onion domes.”  And he said something withering ‑‑ “Don’t tell me, lieutenant, I know what I see,” or something like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8184.0,8200.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/416","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Did you know in London about what was going on with the Jews?  Or not till you got to Prague?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Not until... oh, no, we didn’t have to wait that long.  We did not know, we knew enough, but either the information was not passed out, or we didn’t want to believe it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8200.0,8220.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/417","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Before turning to that topic, I just wanted ‑‑ there are three quick stories.  Well, go ahead, go ahead.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  When the leader of the Jews in London committed suicide, we knew that things were really bad.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What happened?  I don’t...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8220.0,8235.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/418","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  He killed himself.  He, he wrote a note saying, “You’ve done so little for us, there’s no... it’s not worthwhile living.  I am killing myself.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Who was that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I can’t think of his name.  It’s a well-known name.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did you know him through the Hertzes, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I didn’t know him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8235.0,8250.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/419","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  You didn’t know him?  What did you know at the time?  You just... you’d heard rumors, and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, we had intelligence reports.  But you couldn’t tell.  Because I swear, they made up the intelligence reports on the first floor and sent ‘em to the second.  You know, a lot of that stuff.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8250.0,8267.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/420","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  You got to know Hertz of the chumash fame during the war.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Of the what?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  The standard editor of the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  Chief Rabbi.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Chief Rabbi.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8267.0,8279.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/421","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e No, I knew the Chief Rabbi before the war.  I knew them in ‘38.  I was... through families in Baltimore ‑‑ through the Friedenwalds, and the Strausses in Baltimore.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8279.0,8291.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/422","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: Tell the story of meeting your friend, being late for lunch during the Blitz.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I had an appointment with Bill Russell for lunch at a pub right back of Selfridges.  And I think the appointment was for two o’clock or one thirty, I don’t know.  But anyway, I was there, and I waited 15 minutes, and got sore as hell, because he didn’t show up.  And 15 minutes later, a V-2 hit that place, and everybody was killed.  I had enough sense to leave.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Did Bill ever arrive?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8291.0,8328.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/423","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No ‑‑ he’s still in Tunika, Mississippi.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  There you go.  Um, the other story... talk about when you were conducting at the time word came of Roosevelt’s death.  Where were you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8328.0,8341.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/424","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.  Word came of Roosevelt ‑‑ we were doing the Eroica that night.  And there was talk for a few brief minutes about canceling the concert, but somebody must have decided it had to go on.  And we played the Eroica, we played Taps before.  And it was very moving.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8341.0,8368.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/425","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: One other story ‑‑ which I like, because it also touches on your rootlessness, perhaps ‑‑ but tell the story of being caught behind the lines during the Battle of the Bulge, and how you were able to...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, we had... I don’t know how this happened, we had known in the United States Army.  I was... I think I had done a concert in Brussels, and with a fellow friend of mine from, another... one of the military attaches who was from Holland.  We had a few days off, and we decided to go take a trip.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8368.0,8401.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/426","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we got into a command car, and drove up ‑‑ he wanted to go see his friends in Vlissingen, Flushing.  And we drove up and we got there, and there were people in... this was outside territories for Americans, and besides, the Germans were coming, and disguised, and infiltrating.  We met and we saw all these people, and everybody ‑‑ hi, hi, hi.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8401.0,8435.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/427","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And gradually, there were fewer and fewer people in the room, and I realized something was the matter.  And I realized that they thought that we were German spies.  And because, I mean, I spoke German ‑‑ I did not speak Dutch or French.  But then I saved it ‑‑ one of the people who was in the room was the man who sold me that picture, the St. Jerome.  And they realized that I was kosher.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8435.0,8466.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/428","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  What was the story, though?  They asked you about baseball, and then there were racetracks?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  But that’s another story.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Well, tell that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s when I was again in Brussels, at the Palace Hotel.  I was walking in, and an MP comes up and salutes me, and I salute back, and he says, “Do you mind if I ask you a few quick questions, Lieutenant?”  “Go ahead, come on.”  So he said, “How are the Dodgers?”  And I said, “I beg your pardon?  How are the who?”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8466.0,8489.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/429","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Anyway, he said, “Will you come with me?”  Of course, so he took me across to military intelligence.  And this guy says, “You don’t know who the Dodgers are?”  I said, “I never heard of them.”  He said, “Where are you from, lieutenant?  What town?”  And I said, “Baltimore.”  And he said, “Name five racetracks around Baltimore.”  And I said, “All right.  Pimlico, Bowie, Laurel, uh, Harbinger Grass and Timonium.  That’s six.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8489.0,8522.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/430","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJ. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e What composing did you do during the war?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8522.0,8534.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/431","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I wrote quite a bit of radio music.  And I wrote the Soldier Songs.  I tried desperately to write a violin sonata, which I never did.  And I did the Soldier Songs, is the most important thing.  And there are more songs in the cycle than are in... the way they expand.  In other words, there are, I think, three other songs that belong there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8534.0,8565.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/432","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  How did you get to Prague. I mean what quirk made people send you. Did you campaign to go?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No, no nobody was ever more surprised. I had hoped to be sent to Brussels. They sent me to Prague, and I said, “What are you doing?”” Aren’t you from Prague?”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8565.0,8586.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/433","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I said, “No I am from Czechkoslavakia.” They said, “Well what is wrong with that.” I said, “But I do not speak Czeck.” They said “Oh you will in a few days. Two weeks. You’ll learn.” No, they were just purely arbitrary.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8586.0,8599.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/434","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: You were in Prague with the army and later with the State Department.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: That’s right.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: How did that work? How did that happen?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: How did what happen?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: How did you switch? How long were you there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8599.0,8610.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/435","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: Oh well I was getting out. I was due to be sent home in about January or February, the war having ended when? The previous June or July, I’ve forgotten.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: May\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: May\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: May in Europe\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: August everywhere else.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8610.0,8626.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/436","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, well I was supposed to be sent home, but I was still needed because you know there was an awful lot to do at the Embassy. So many thousands of people trying to get out. And I had become friendly with many of the consulate people and friendly with the Ambassador. He asked me one day whether I would like to come and be assistant cultural attache. And being that I had no prospects of a job, had no idea what I would do, I said “Sure, I’ll be glad to go.” I did it mainly because it was a job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8626.0,8667.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/437","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: This was Ambassador…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Steinhardt\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: Steinhardt. What happened to him? \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: He was killed in a plane crash.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: What did you do? I know you that you occasionally take things into your own hands in Prague either militarily, as military attache or cultural attache. What do you mean there was so much to do and so many people trying to get out?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8667.0,8692.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/438","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Theoretically, the cultural attache had nothing to do with it but I took it on myself. There were these millions, these hundreds of thousands of refugees from the East coming through Czechoslavakia. And I played a not inconsiderable part in expediting their lives and sending them to DP camps, so that they weren’t either shipped back to Russia or kept in Poland forcibly or something like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8692.0,8719.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/439","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: These were Jews or people…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Everything.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: Or all kinds of people.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Mostly Jews but I didn’t ask questions.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: They were leaving what was.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: They were running away.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: From the Russians.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: From the Russians.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8719.0,8733.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/440","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: There were also many Jews that were trying to get South to the Mediterranean, were there not?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yeah but oddly enough I don’t recall many specific incidents. I recall mostly people getting into DP camps.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: So, they wouldn’t have to stay…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: So they can get away from the Russians and the Poles as fast as they could.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8733.0,8763.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/441","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e Now you told me one story. I do not remember all the details, but it was a meeting where a presiding officer threatened a Court Martial of anyone… Tell us that story and all the details.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8763.0,8776.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/442","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah it was a meeting one day on the office of the embassy staff and it was a sudden meeting called by the ambassador. And none of us had any idea what was going on. We went to the meeting and the ambassador said ”Ladies and Gentelmen, I’m here to tell you if I find anymore of you, if I hear of anymore of you going up to the Czech foreign office without consulting the political officers here, I’ll have your court martialed and sent back home.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8776.0,8805.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/443","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Because everybody who was in an individual potencia, or potencia is a petition, or a complaint, they just went up to the foreign office, which was fairly opened and asked, and maybe sometimes they got their way. But it’s not, it’s not something that is done through channels.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8805.0,8827.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/444","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we all went home. And after the meeting, I walked over to Steinhardt and he shook hands with me and said good job because the day before I had been up to see Masaryk without permission to see that the borders were kept open so that the Czechoslovakia would not close its borders to people, to the refugees coming in from the East.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8827.0,8848.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/445","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: So Steinhardt was Jewish?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Steinhardt was Jewish\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: Tell the story of the fella who came into your office.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Oh no, don’t make me tell that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: Tell it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: Tell it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8848.0,8861.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/446","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e A guy comes into my office still dressed in concentration camp clothes and he demands a visa to Paris. And you know, I didn’t take any bullshit from anybody in those days. I said, “What do you mean, you demand?” And he put his hands on my desk.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8861.0,8885.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/447","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"His fingers had been cut off and he said he used to be a pianist. Don’t make me tell that story again. It feels like it had happened yesterday.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8885.0,8916.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/448","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: Why did he want to go to Paris?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: Why did he want to go to Paris?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Why did he want to go to Paris? I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: Was he French?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: But I got him there.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: You did?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Sure, of course.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: And what about just one other story of one of your… Someone else came into your office from Ivančice.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8916.0,8935.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/449","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh well yes, that was to tell me that they have put my cousins into the gas chambers. Oddly enough, I never found that as moving. But maybe because he wasn’t a pianist. No, a man named Goldman, Maurice Goldman, who I knew when I was a child from Ivančice had come back from Terezin and saw my name, climbed up the stairs, and asked me whether I was indeed Weisgall from Ivančice.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8935.0,8968.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/450","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eJ. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Crematorium.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8968.0,8980.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/451","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: A Jew who worked, had that as a job.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yeah that was his job.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: To survive. Who was Vorhand?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Vorhand was a rabbi who survived the war a very strong, brilliant, extremely hard-working operator, kind of which just the most extraordinary thing. He was responsible for the lives of so many people. How he did it, I don’t know. Never knew. But he had more connections with more embassies and more consulates than anyone I know. But he did a tremendous job in helping refugees get out from the East.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=8980.0,9020.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/452","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: Did you work with him?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Oh yes, I…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: In what ways? \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Well I would go out and steal passes or go out and sign passes or go out to the embassy and do this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9020.0,9034.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/453","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: You had the power then to authorize individual human beings to transit and leave Czechoslavakia.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yes\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: And at that time that was…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: Was that cultural attache?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I don’t know. I signed my name as attache.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9034.0,9050.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/454","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: Mhm. And that was of great value for…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: For the people who’s lives were saved, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: And how were their lives saved by you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Well they got out of Czechoslovakia. They got to a place where they can have food and clothing and shelter. And to the DP camps which the United States Army set up all along the Eastern border of Germany, for people coming west from Russia and south from Poland.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9050.0,9078.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/455","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: It was not much fun to be in Russia or Poland.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: Were you at the, at the, liberation of any concentration camps.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: How soon after they were liberated were you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I was in Terezin I don’t know. Three, four, three weeks after, after it was cleared.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9078.0,9096.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/456","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: What did you see?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: What do you remember for that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Well all the pictures that you see and all the documentaries. I remember I was… Do I remember this guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9096.0,9113.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/457","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I uh, I went to Terezin, just telling you, because I had to see it. And there were still people lying in the bunkers and sleeping in those wooden slats. And the funny thing was that there was an epidemic of typhus and the Czecks were not taking care of it. And I raised hell about that at some risk to myself because I went into the typhus place, screamed a bit and got it taken care of. But it could have been a very serious epidemic.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9113.0,9156.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/458","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: You were in Prague for just about two years, and uh conducted a lot. Did you write?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yes, uh, I wrote a ballet called Outpost, which when translated, the idea of outpost is utterly foreign to Czechs so they translated it to poslední zastávka [?] which means the last stop, like a street car stop [laughs].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9156.0,9199.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/459","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: Was it performed?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Oh yeah, the ballet as such not. The communists came in and hanged the, they hanged the choreographer.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: And you. That’s going to stop a ballet. You…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yeah it settled that question.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: You played music with Jan Masaryk?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: A lot? A little? How did you know him?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9199.0,9218.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/460","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: Well like three, four times, five times, who knows.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: What did you do? Did you accompamy him?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No we played duets.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: Four-hand again?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: What was he like?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Oh, wonderful man. Funny, great character. Vey, very, he was an extraordinary man. One day we were supposed to have dinner. This was back in London and dinner was something like seven o’clock. It comes eight o’clock, comes eight thirty, no Masaryk. Finally, the doorbell rings, and he comes to the door and he’s totally drunk. He said, “I spent the afternoon with Winnie and that man can drink much more than I can.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9218.0,9271.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/461","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: With Churchill on?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yeah, yeah. With Winnie. And he, this guy was so drunk. Masaryk was about as military as I am. Very wonderful guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9271.0,9287.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/462","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Wonderful story about him. Uh, at a party, we were leaving a party one night. And the ambassador, Mrs. Ambassador, Dolcy says, ask Jan, can you come to lunch or…? He said, “My dear Dolcy, even a whore has a day off and that’s tomorrow for me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9287.0,9305.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/463","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: As cultural, in your capacity as cultural attache, back to the arts, didn’t you, weren’t you involed in actually writing the catalog of American art? What was that about?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I wrote the catalog. There was a book as an exhibition put out by the State Department called Advancing American Art. They bought all the pictures and organized the show and they sent me the stuff and said,” Do a catalog.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9305.0,9333.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/464","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: Now I’ve never seen many of these pictures, but I wrote a catalog, which still has some very good stuff in it today. I was amused to see it the other day.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: What did the Communists think about that exhibit?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: They came.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9333.0,9345.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/465","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: They didn’t denounce it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: They did not denounce it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No, no. For a mater of fact, they gave it quite a bit of play in Kosice[?]. Um you were in Kosice[?].","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9345.0,9358.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/466","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: Mhm\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yeah\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: Did you, you met Shostakovich there, did’t you? You sheparded him around.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I met Shostakovich in Prague and then here in the United States.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: You, um, I can’t recall what it was but a while ago, you talked about having been on the Communist’s, blacklist, or I forget…","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9358.0,9383.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/467","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: Hitlist\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: Hitlist, yeah. There was something about you being afraid to go. This is of course, 12, 14 years ago or so. You…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Well I wanted to go back to Prague.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: And they said, “Oh you’ll get a visa easily if you apply.” I said, “No I was turned down once.” “No, you get it.” So, we applied again from Rome. We were trying to go to Prague. And the cable finally came in and said, “Mission denied as he’s an enemy of the state.” So, um…","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9383.0,9421.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/468","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN: That was because…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Because they had known what I’d done.\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: Because you have helped.\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: During the war. Yeah. You can’t imagine what, conservatively speaking, I must have been involved in the fate of at least 250, 350,000 people. By sheer numbers of documents that I signed and things that I did. It was from morning to night, people, people, people. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9421.0,9453.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/469","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: Did you bring Lenny Bernstein to Prague?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No, Lenny Bernstein was sent to Prague by the State Department, but I organized his trip. I did not bring him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9453.0,9464.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/470","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Why did you feel that you had to go back, that you couldn’t make a career, that you didn’t want to make a career in Europe. Why did you feel you had to do it in the United States? Was it…?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9464.0,9477.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/471","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: Because I was an American.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: Not a Jew in the Twenteith century living in America.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No because I was an American. Yeah, yeah. But I mean I didn’t make a speech about it, I just.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9477.0,9493.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/472","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: When did you change your last name from one L to two L’s.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: You don’t know?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No.\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: Did you ever, you must have made a legal change at some point.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: You simply adapted a second “L”.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Adopted an “L”, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9493.0,9507.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/473","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: Did mother come over when you left the army and joined the state department or did she come over when you were still in the Army?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: When, when I joined the state department.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: Because then it was allowed. It was permitted for her to come.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yeah, mhm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9507.0,9522.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/474","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: Was my being born have anything to do with your wanting to go back?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No, I always wanted to go back.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: You left the state department about when?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: 194..\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: 48?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: 48 or 49.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: 47, 47.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: You were born in 47.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I think I left in 49.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9522.0,9543.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/475","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: What did you do for two years?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I worked in Prague.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: No, because I was three months old when we came back.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Oh, oh here looking for jobs. I used to go to New York every week hunting for jobs. I never got, I could not get neither, I could neither get an apartment or a job. And all these people and these Americans who I busted my back for as cultural attache so much as decided to play a piece of mine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9543.0,9574.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/476","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e But you also, at that point, when did you start conducting the… You sarted conducting at Hopkins, you started Hilltop, you started everything you can start. You started the Chamber Music Society in Baltimore. So you just made jobs where there were no jobs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9574.0,9620.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/477","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: But you know, there was no income for many of these places.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: How did you earn money?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I don’t know. I mean it was tiny income.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: Little things coming from everywhere.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Fifty dollars here. I used to give vocal lessons at two dollars and fifty cents an hour.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9620.0,9637.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/478","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: Yeah, I remember the one with the big braid coming in. The woman with the long braid. She sang at Hilltop too.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Well, I don’t remember.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: Phyllis maybe.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Phyllis Frankle.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: Could have been.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9637.0,9654.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/479","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN: Anyway, you found something more than the choir-conducting job eventually.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: In Baltimore, yes, quite quickly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: What did you find? What else?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Well I was asked to become the leader of the Hartford County Choral Society and the John Hopkins Orchestra and the Chamber Music Society Orchastra. Just a few small things. I was never given a teaching job at Peabody.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9654.0,9682.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/480","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL: Or at Hopkins.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Well Hopkins, no. I had a Hopkins Orchestra. That was considered a job, but they had no other music department anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9682.0,9695.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/481","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: When did you start performing the symphonies of William Schuman and Henry Cowell.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Whenever I had places where they would…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: Rochberg. Didn’t you do a piece of Rochberg.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yes, yes, I did the Rochberg First Symphony, Chamber Symphony.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9695.0,9712.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/482","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: And how had you met all these people? How would you become colleuges with them?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I met them all when I started to come to New York to, again, try to establish some kind of identity. Um, because, I was saying before, I was never part of the New York scene. So, when I came back looking for a job in New York, there were no jobs and there was nobody I knew.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9712.0,9733.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/483","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I did go to Bill Schuman in 1945 and we did talk of my teaching at Julliard, but by that time, I had already agreed to go abroad for the State Department, and nothing ever came of that. And then, well it was very tough. I lived on practically nothing for quite a few years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9733.0,9761.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/484","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN: But you could have stayed at the State Department if you wanted to.\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No, they closed my… Yes, if I had gone… \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: You could have transferred to another.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: to Yugoslavia, yes, yeah. But I just couldn’t. The thought of goiong to another East European country, cold and all of these people not, it was much too much to deal with for me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9761.0,9783.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/485","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e So between the time, between 19 what was it, 49 and the time that you began with the Jewish Theological Seminary which was in what, 1953?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9783.0,9797.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/486","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: When?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: 53 or 52.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: That late?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: 52, 52, 52. In that time frame, before you began there, what kind of involvement did you have Judaically, I mean music-wise.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I used to go to shul.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9797.0,9811.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/487","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN: Uh [laughter], when the Jewish Theological Seminary came to you…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Yeah\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: as the logical, uh if not obvious.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: No, I was about number ten on the list.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: Really? I heard it but tell me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9811.0,9828.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/488","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: What? Well I mean they asked Ernest Bloch first. \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: Well they…\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: And then they asked Darius Milhaud and I don’t know who else.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: Well no, then I stand by my statement, logical and obvious because of obviously Bloch had a bigger name internationally.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: Sure did.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9828.0,9849.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/489","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e But he hadn’t had any Judaic involvement. In fact, he was nearly flirting with converting to Christianity all together. I mean the fact that he had just released some Judaically-orientated works but so did composers who aren’t Jewish but that’s it. And the same is true of Milhaud. But that was for a different reason, in terms of the, of the logical aspect. You must have been approached because of the straddling of two worlds, if not more than two, in terms of Judaic cantorial background on the one hand.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9849.0,9880.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/490","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL: I don’t know. I don’t even. I don’t even to this day know who recommended me.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN: Well how did it come about?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I was conducting a rehearsal of my opera when there was a telephone call from William Schuman and he was in orchestra rehearsal I was conducting, not a piano rehearsal. Mr. William Schuman, and I said, “Well I’m conducting an orchestra rehearsal.” “Very important,” so I came up stairs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9880.0,9910.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/491","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And Will said, “How would you like to be the head of music at the Jewish Theological Seminary?” I said, “What the hell are you talking about?” Well the way that it was presented at the time was a tremendous job, so it wasn’t. So, I mean, I agreed. And you know who interviewed me about my competence? Richard Tucker. Yep.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9910.0,9935.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/492","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN: They asked Tucker to interview you?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You’re sure it was Tucker, not Peerce?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9935.0,9940.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/493","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  It may have been Peerce.  You know, the moment I said Tucker, I thought, ah! maybe it was Peerce.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But it was one of the two?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And it was obviously for effect, I mean, nobody there felt they...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  At the Russian Tea Room.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Huh.  That was around 1952.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9940.0,9954.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/494","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  You don’t remember any of the other candidates that they were looking for to be....  So when you met with either Peerce or Tucker, and then what?  What transpired?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Then I spoke to Finkelstein on the phone, and this great job, which was supposed to constitute the core of my living, came down to a half a day a week.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9954.0,9975.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/495","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  And what did Finkelstein call the job?  I mean, did he call it Chairman of the Faculty to begin with, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t remember.  I think that was invented by Rutenberg.  I’m not sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And, but any rate, you were...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  You know, but it was talked up as being a serious academic job.  And here I thought I was gonna have a conservatory or something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9975.0,9995.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/496","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Well, you accept, you made a deal with them, and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Sure.  Sure.  It was a job.  At that time, I had a synagogue, and a chorus in Hartford, and now that.  So I could afford to eat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=9995.0,10009.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/497","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN: The perception was not that you were down the list of people or anything, that in fact one of the reasons that they came to you was because you were prestigious in your own right.  And I’m not just saying that ‑‑ I seem to recall something that also had to do with the yichus, with the fact that you came from the Chizuk Amuno and your father was cantor there ‑‑ and that it was somebody’s vision, but I don’t recall who and you don’t either, at the Seminary.  You didn’t know anybody there, did you?  Personally anyone connected with the Seminary?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  Wasn’t William Schuman asked for a recommendation?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10009.0,10048.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/498","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  Because he certainly has either written or said or something...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes, William Schuman was asked for a recommendation, yeah, sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  Of course, he was extremely important, then, and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  So maybe...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10048.0,10063.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/499","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes, definitely, William Schuman played a big part in this.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Now, when you began the first year, which is 1952.  You still lived in Baltimore for a while yet, I guess.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  For ten years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10063.0,10078.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/500","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Ten years.  And you just came in once a week.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Mmmm-hmmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  There was an opening ceremony of some sort, or convocation of the school...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  There was a convocation at the beginning, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I think it was at Juilliard.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  It was at Juilliard.  I don’t remember very much about it.  I don’t remember who sang, or what they sang, or anything else, or who spoke.  I think Finkie may have spoken.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10078.0,10103.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/501","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  With Finkelstein, did you develop any kind of relationship with him?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  None whatsoever.  I had one or two interviews with Finkelstein, threatening to walk out.  But...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  And what did he say?  I mean, what was his attitude towards the whole thing?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I didn’t walk out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10103.0,10125.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/502","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  I mean, what was his attitude towards the Cantors’ Institute, the music school?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, he had nothing that I knew that could be identified as attitude.  I really, no... he had no real interest at all.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You never discussed music with him at all?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10125.0,10140.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/503","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh, no, no.  No, you discussed music with Moshe Davis or Mandelbaum.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Tell me about that, about Moshe Davis.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Huh?  Davis was very important with the Institute.  He was a big fighter for the Institute, and, I think, a big supporter.  In those days, of course, he also held, had Finkelstein’s ear, and usually got what it is he wanted.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10140.0,10166.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/504","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Davis was, as it were, on our side, I mean...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...in terms of the value of the music and so forth.  And now...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  And then, of course, there was Bernie Mandelbaum later.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And what was he like?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10166.0,10180.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/505","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  A grober ying (uncouth, boor).\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  All right, when you decided to head the school ‑‑ and whatever title that it was, and we can check that in the bulletin easily enough ‑‑ how about the planning for the curriculum of the school?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10180.0,10194.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/506","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e We sat down ‑‑ Max, Max Rutenberg, Max Wohlberg, Max Rutenberg, I don’t know whether David Putterman was there or not ‑‑ and we just thrashed out a curriculum.  You know, knowing what to call things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10194.0,10218.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/507","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We ended up with far too many courses.  We constantly tried cutting, we tried cutting down the number of courses we had.  But the first graduating, the first class to enter was... they were all college graduates, at that point.  And some of them, pretty good backgrounds.  So you had really someone to teach.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10218.0,10241.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/508","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the quality after the first year dropped precipitously. \u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Whose idea was it to make the school more than simply a conservatory-type training, almost trade school for cantors?  Especially, with reference, for example, to an Ethnomusicology Department?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10241.0,10263.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/509","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  That was your idea?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Mmm-mmm.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So you had some interest in ethnomusicology...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes, yes.  Talking of that, I used to have to fight Moshe Davis, because he didn’t want Johanna Spector around.  And I did.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10263.0,10281.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/510","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  How did that happen?  The Spector?  Tell the story about how you settled on Spector.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t how I settled on her, because God knows I didn’t know much about ethnomusicology.  But she had very good references, I read her dissertation and one or two of her articles, which were well-written.  Of course, I never could understand that it was at the core of everything in her thinking, but the less I understood, the more she insisted on it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10281.0,10309.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/511","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was a very difficult time keeping her, because a lot of people wanted to get rid of her.  But I insisted on, first of all, that we teach comparative nusaḥ.  And that we do these ethnomusicology things, and that we make the students believe that it’s... make the students, try to convince the students that it’s just more than getting up on a Friday night or Saturday and davenning the service.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10309.0,10336.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/512","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  So you really brought Spector?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  The other thing is the emphasis on high culture of Western music in the Cantors’ Institute curriculum from the very beginning, and what would you call it, kaleggi?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10336.0,10352.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/513","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  High culture music we used to call music.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So that was... now it’s a separate field.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, it’s high culture, but then it was culture.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  All right now, so that the idea to...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, the idea was to train not only a hazzan, but a good musician.  With some knowledge of the general repertoire.  Like lieder and psalm.  Not necessarily opera.  But also to know that there’s such a thing as chamber music, but not to let it bother you too much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10352.0,10386.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/514","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  All right.  So that was from the beginning, the requirement to acquit oneself at least somewhat admirably of the knowledge of lieder...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Was yours, that was your idea?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003e","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10386.0,10406.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/515","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  And that’s... did you get any opposition from others there on that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes, there used to be lots of opposition.  “Why do they have to know this?  They can get this on the outside.”  Well, the answer to that is they don’t know it, and they don’t get it on the outside, so...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10406.0,10421.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/516","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But how did you prevail?  All this time, until this day, because you know that, for example, Hebrew Union College doesn’t allot one moment of its curriculum ‑‑ never did ‑‑ for Schubert or Schuman, lieder, I mean, that stuff.  And...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Maybe their students don’t need it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10421.0,10437.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/517","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  No, what I’m getting at is, that we all agree that this is one of the great strengths of the Seminary, that you instituted, but how did you manage to hold your own against opposition?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I just don’t let opposition bother me too much.  Necessarily.  I mean, I’ve been able to overcome it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Overall, what... throughout the... let’s say, from ‘50-, right from ‘52 on and throughout, let’s say, the ‘60s, ‘50s and ‘60s ‑‑ in the scheme of your own life, I mean in the overall scheme of your whole life, emotional involvement as well, but certainly your musical life ‑‑ where did the Seminary and the Cantors’ Institute fit in in terms of your overall concerns?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10437.0,10480.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/518","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e That’s not a fair question for me to try to answer, because first of all, I’m obviously doing less work.  And, I mean, I very much miss the fact that I don’t have any contact, at the moment, with the Chorus.  Or that my classes are quite peripheral.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10480.0,10505.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/519","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e I mean you devoted a certain amount of effort and time and emotional energy to planning, to thinking about the school.  I mean, I’ve seen all the correspondence about curriculum and about everything else, in the ‘50s and ‘60s, and it’s way, way more than one would expect for a one-day-a-week job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10505.0,10525.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/520","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah.  Oh, God, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I mean, you had visions.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I should do much... but, you know, I am, what is it?  What is the word ‑‑ downsizing, is that it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Uh, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  If one wants to use it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10525.0,10544.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/521","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  I think that Neil is asking, though ‑‑ not now, but he’s asking in the past.  Where did it, how did it, what was its place?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I always thought of it as a kind of a seminar conservatory.  Graduate students to talk about things.  Well, the courses I taught, like The Twentieth Century, and just things like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10544.0,10571.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/522","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e But from the time... it seems, from the time that you started, in 1952, you got increasingly involved in talking about and thinking about Jewish music, whatever that is.  Judaically-related musical things, because throughout the period you gave some lectures independently of the Seminary.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10571.0,10596.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/523","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, for example, there’s a lecture I’d love to see what you said, or if it’s written anywhere, called Jewish Music Reconsidered ‑‑ Fragments of Experience.  Do you remember that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, I remember that title.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You gave that in 1966.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10596.0,10610.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/524","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah, I think I ran across a few pages of it the other day.  If I do find it, I’ll give it to you.  But that’s definitely me, that sounds like me.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.  You don’t remember what...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Fragments...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10610.0,10625.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/525","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Fragments of experience.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Can you talk...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Probably we were going to talk about things that had happened.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Now, during the 1950 period, 1952 to today, there have been a great many changes, I mean changes, obviously, in faculty, administration, and so forth.  But how, in particular, did you notice...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10625.0,10645.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/526","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Since Schorsh has been there, much more has been accomplished.  Schorsh is really interested, and from an intellectual, Germanic point of view.  Good Central European gymnasium kind of stuff.  With which I can very easily associate.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10645.0,10661.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/527","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  And, of course, I think the quality of students has gone up tremendously.  I am very pleased about that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  What about the quality of singing?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I don’t know, I haven’t heard enough yet.  I’ve got to hear it.  I’m sure that there are problems.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10661.0,10680.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/528","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e Did you develop any... I mean, you taught the Choral Bibliography course, as the survey of synagogue music literature.  I don’t know for how many years, but now, so you must have a developed a point of view on synagogue music literature and your curriculum and so forth.  I mean, you gave this a lot of thought during that time.  Any thoughts for the future on that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10680.0,10710.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/529","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No.  I’d like to introduce more contemporary music.  I don’t know how good most of it is.  I found most of it not banal, but bland.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Now, in 1953, I think it was ‑‑ it was the end of the first year of the Cantors’ Institute, you were invited to give a talk at the Rabbinical Assembly...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  In Atlantic City.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10710.0,10733.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/530","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  That was one of the greater triumphs.  I don’t know what I did, but I certainly did not end up smelling like a rose.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, I wanted to ask you about that, because this was an important turning point.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  A political thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10733.0,10747.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/531","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Well, they asked you ‑‑ this was a Rabbinical Assembly Convention, not a Cantors’ Assembly ‑‑ to talk about the new school at the Seminary.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And its curriculum, or whatever else.  And apparently, you brought, from what I could see in the correspondence, you brought a chorus of students to sing, to demonstrate some things there.  Do you remember this?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t remember that at all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10747.0,10766.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/532","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  It’s not clear whether they were a chorus of students from the Seminary or people you brought from Baltimore, that’s what’s not clear.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I can’t imagine from Baltimore, because after the Assembly, we turned north and went to Maine.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eI don’t know what you said there, and you don’t have a copy, do you...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...of what you said in this talk that you gave?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10766.0,10785.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/533","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But it obviously was a major talk, it wasn’t a peripheral little set of remarks.  And apparently, you caused quite a stir of unhappiness among the Rabbinical Assembly.  And you got some letters, and one in particular from that Rabbi at Chizuk Amuno ‑‑ Goldman, was that his name?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL AND WEISGALL:  Hmm-mmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10785.0,10812.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/534","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  And he told you what everybody had been unhappy about.  Now, apparently you mentioned that ‑‑ you talk about congregational singing.  And one of the things that he quoted you as saying was that the only congregation, the only types of congregational singing that meet your approval in principle are responsorial and hymnal.  Do you remember that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  Responsorial, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10812.0,10843.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/535","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Well, hymns meaning Adon Olom, or Ein Keloheinu ‑‑ they’re not hymns, but whatever.  We know that’s what he meant by it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  What’s wrong with that?  I mean, doesn’t that cover everything?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  How did he...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So what was the stir about?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10843.0,10856.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/536","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I have no idea.  Maybe they didn’t want to have responses.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, then he said that you demonstrated with the chorus...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Something terrible.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Some terrible stuff, to show what was inappropriate...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10856.0,10869.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/537","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e ...for any synagogue.  What shouldn’t be done.  The depths to which some congregations have sunk, which we as Seminary graduates must make sure is avoided.  Now what... but he doesn’t say what you sang, and do you have any recollection of... it was some Pesach melody that you...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10869.0,10886.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/538","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Betzeis Yisroel.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Which one?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  (Sings)  Betzeis, Betzeis, Yisroel, Isroel, mi-mi, mi-mi, Mitzrayim, Mitzrayim, beis yanck, beis yanck....  Betzeis Yisroel, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10886.0,10901.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/539","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e So you were demonstrating....  Now, Goldman says, without identifying the tune you just sang, which, I mean, obviously makes a mockery of the language, to say nothing to say nothing of the music ‑‑ he said, “Hugo, we all agree with you that that kind of stuff is inappropriate, period, in synagogue, but you’re absolutely wrong if you think that any synagogue would stoop to use that sort of thing.”  So obviously, they were.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10901.0,10925.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/540","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah.  Of course they were.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You must have heard it somewhere, too.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Sure.  I wouldn’t have known it otherwise.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Did you know it from your students?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You’re sure.  That’s the logical...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  I probably knew it from a Chanukah concert I had to go to or something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10925.0,10944.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/541","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  So overall, how have, I mean, how do you think the future will fare for the Cantors’ Institute?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I’m fairly optimistic when I come back from a faculty meeting, having heard the auditions.  With all the criticisms . . .","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10944.0,10966.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/542","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  And the Ethnomusicology Department, of course is no more.  Were you sorry to see that go?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And we’ve had... would you say, I mean, who was it responsible ‑‑ was it your responsibility, in the early days, especially, to bring the faculty ‑‑ people like Kraft, and what’s-his name?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Gideon.  Gideon.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10966.0,10989.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/543","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I did less than that, because Morty was much more of a hands-on dean than...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But that was later.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But in the Kogen days, for example.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, I was responsible for that.  I used to, they used to call on for coaches, but I haven’t called... there aren’t, the personnel is not that much available.  Although this new guy, Gerald Cohen, is very good.  You know him?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=10989.0,11013.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/544","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The students like him very well.  And he seems to be doing a good job, and I think he’s a fairly talented man.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Talk about your... I mean, I would certainly have lots to talk about if I had been involved in a... professionally, with you, in my life.  I haven’t been.  What... talk about that involvement with your own father.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11013.0,11035.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/545","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e It’s very difficult for me to speak about my own father.  I’ve been trying to, in the past few days, weeks.  Because I mean I realize, first of all, he’s... the depth, the quality and depth of his musicality are much greater than anybody ever realized.  And once I’ve said that, I’ve said it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11035.0,11057.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/546","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Who did he turn them over to? Never mind. Keep going.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11057.0,11073.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/547","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e But there was a... he had a tremendous lyrical gift as a composer, and certainly as a singer he did.  He was a wonderful, wonderful singer.  And everybody agrees that.  But what else can one say?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11073.0,11086.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/548","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: Describe your own emotional relationship with your father.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  We were very close.  We talked a great deal.  I never... I told him everything that had to be said.  I never kept things from him.  I frequently may have been overly critical.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11086.0,11104.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/549","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Of him?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  But we got along very well.  \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Was he the most important musical influence in your life?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I’ve been thinking who is.  Probably my father.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Probably your father?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Hmm-mmm.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11104.0,11119.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/550","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  On that subject, by the way, this is kind of a goofy question, but with what composers do you most closely identify?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, with what composers do I most identify?  With Brahms, with Schubert, with Verdi, with Stravinsky.  Haydn.  I don’t dare throw Beethoven in, because he was so, what?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11119.0,11152.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/551","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Could you briefly just explain those five ‑‑ Brahms, Schubert, Verdi...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  They’re all part of the major Central European tradition, to which I feel myself attached.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Why Stravinsky?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11152.0,11166.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/552","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Why Stravinsky?  Because of his classicism.  And his brilliant imaginative qualities that he has.  Because of his trenchant attitudes, his wit, his ability to read into things.  That’s why.  He just, he managed to become a part of the great Central European tradition without having had to be.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11166.0,11205.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/553","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But that’s a funny question ‑‑ how does one identify with a composer?  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You’re talking about people you admire, really, more than identify.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  I have a question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11205.0,11217.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/554","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  How do you know when to admire somebody?  You admire them, you know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:   The, you know, everyone has said, recently, that you had Esther, you had this great critical triumph at the age of 81, or whatever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11217.0,11231.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/555","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e It was something that I started to do and wanted to do and wanted to continue doing, so I kept up.  Stopping wouldn’t make it better.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11231.0,11256.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/556","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSAYER:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I’d like to address this a little bit.  Just ‘cause I remember a lot of things that you said to me over the years. But one week, I said, at my lesson, to which I would extravagantly look forward to, “I’m just having a horrible time composing.  I can’t seem to get anything out, and I’m not inspired.”  And so you said, “Well, just go do it.  It’s your job.  Just do it.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11256.0,11275.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/557","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e That’s true.  That’s your job.  That’s what you’re there to do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11275.0,11287.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/558","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSAYER:\u003c/strong\u003e So you were always very proud of your work and the craftsmanship of it.  And I think that was something very telling to me, because it bespoke of a certain quality and standard that you held for yourself, and that was infectious in your students.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11287.0,11308.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/559","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  You frequently cringe when you’re described as an artist.  Is that correct?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, well that’s...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Why?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Because I’m peculiar.  I mean, there’s no other reason.  I don’t like the word “creative,” because it’s phony.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11308.0,11324.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/560","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Levin: You once said to me... that you were terribly bourgeois.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And is it because that’s a straitjacket from which you secretly want to emerge, or have wanted to?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11324.0,11338.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/561","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e All my life I’ve wanted to.  Never had the courage.  But I don’t know what I would do, emerging at this point.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11338.0,11350.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/562","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Neil gave me this to read, which I think is sort of right on the point here. You wrote a letter to Rabbi Kogan in 1963, I guess he’d asked for biographical material.  “Enclosed is material about myself.  As for a personal statement, too late for me to say anything at this age.”  This is more than 30 years ago.  “Manifestos should belong to the young.  When you are young you can easily make statements which later can either be forgiven or forgotten.  All that I can honestly say is that it’s a damn tough job, writing music.  I suppose it always has been.  From my point of view, I find it very hard.  I try to do the best I can at all times.  I think I am as self-critical as one can be and yet continue writing.  I feel that I may have something to say in opera, but in that most difficult and formless form in which taste plays so large a part, the going is not easy.”  So maybe that’s your manifesto.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11350.0,11410.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/563","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.  I’m astounded, you know, because these things are so much more literary than I... my letters, I mean, I think of myself as writing, “Thank you for your note.  I’ll write you next week.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11410.0,11423.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/564","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e When we talk about the various worlds that you bridge and straddle, I mean, in the Jewish component, it isn’t just that you have a certain family history, and a certain background, and certain inner feelings, ‘cause there are other composers who also say they feel very Jewish, this and that and the other thing, whatever that means.  But in your case, I mean, am I correct, you can get up, you do get up and function...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11423.0,11449.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/565","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Jewishly.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Jewishly as a cantor.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I mean, you know the nusaḥ.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You can daven the ma'ariv, you can daven the minḥa, you daven Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I prefer not to, but...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But you know how to.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And you know the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And you don’t prefer not to.  You’ve been doing it for many years.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, no, no, no.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, the High Holidays.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s just the High Holidays.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  That’s true.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11449.0,11468.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/566","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  And I wouldn’t have done that if I hadn’t succeeded my father.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But you do it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  And I know the nusaḥ from having gone to shul all my life.  That’s how you learn.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Did your father ever sit down and teach you the nusaḥ, or you just absorbed it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11468.0,11482.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/567","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e No, no, no.  Just absorbed it.  I looked at so much music.  I mean, for instance, I spent the past few weeks looking over Bryan Meyer’s Shalosh Regalim.  Well, I learned a lot of stuff in there that I didn’t know.  Nothing spectacular.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11482.0,11501.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/568","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  You know that the minḥa’s pentatonic...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, I know that, sure...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...and you know exactly what to do, which most people don’t know unless they go to cantorial school or are trained in it...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...formally.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11501.0,11515.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/569","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL: Abba, your father, stopped davenning in 1975.  You took over, having conducted the choir in Baltimore, you took over as hazzan and choir.  And on, at the end of Yom Kippur in the late afternoon, I was across, at the apartment...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Johnny was in shul, and I was at home.  I had gone home to rest.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Who was very upset?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11515.0,11539.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/570","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Abba was sitting there, watching television.  He was not aware of anything.  And he looked at me, and he said, “What day is it?”  And I said, “It’s Thursday, Papa.”  And he said, “It’s Yom Kippur.”  I said, “Yes, it’s Yom Kippur.”  And he said, “I have got to get dressed.”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11539.0,11554.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/571","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You were in shul.  And he got dressed, and I walked him across the street.  And I walked him into the synagogue.  He wouldn’t let me, God forbid, a woman, get near the bimah, so you must have taken him up.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And I took him up...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  It was at the end of...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11554.0,11569.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/572","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  I don’t know, Oy, hoo, elohim, the seven time.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, we finished Avinu Malkeinu, and he pushed you aside.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And he finished up the services. It was Yom Kippur and \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  It was instinct.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL: ... it was instinct, that’s exactly what it was.  And do you remember that he finished out the services?  It was...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And his voice ‑‑ he sounded like he was 30. And he was 90.\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  It was absolutely astonishing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11569.0,11590.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/573","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  So you actually, I didn’t know this before.  I was talking about Maine.  You functioned at Chizuk Amuno as the Hazzan.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.  When my father could no longer do it, I leapt in.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL: He had the choir on the bimah so he could conduct the choir at the same that he was davenning.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11590.0,11608.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/574","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  You’ve been, for example, doing Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur in Maine for how long?  A long time?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Twelve or 13 years.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  More.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Including this last year.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Mmm-hmmm.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  And you started a choir recently there?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  He didn’t start the choir.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I didn’t start the choir.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  No.  A doctor up there said this music is too good for one person, I mean, you know, I come up, Johnny comes up, you can’t be a choir.  He started a choir.  I go to the rehearsals in the summers, Hugo goes, he listens...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Who are the people that sing in the choir?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  People from the street.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11608.0,11636.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/575","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  A lobsterer, some doctors.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  People who live there all year round?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Lobstermen.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Men and women, of course.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Men and women.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11636.0,11644.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/576","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  How many do you have?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Fourteen they had last year.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  This is extraordinary.  You can’t get a choir in New York City.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t understand why the Seminary hasn’t made a big deal out of it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  We should go up there and do a story about it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Three times a week, at the end of the summer.  And everybody is there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11644.0,11658.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/577","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  I go to services at the largest and most important synagogue in Washington, D.C., and they haul out four or five people to sing on a Friday night.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What is most interesting to me from growing up thinking that this music is gone, we’re never gonna hear it again, all of a sudden, finding that it’s very beautiful, people love it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  When you say “this music...”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11658.0,11683.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/578","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  This Central European...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  In 1994, what do you do there for the holidays?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  But you begin with erev Rosh Hashanah with the Naumberg Bar’khu, and then you go into Naumberg at the beginning...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Or actually easier is Kol Nidre, you bring the Bi-yeshibah shel ma’alah, then you do the Lewandowski Kol Nidre, and then...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I’ve got a curious question.  You do the Lewandowski Kol Nidre, but you do the one he wrote for the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  For the three voices.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11683.0,11709.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/579","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  No, but you do the one with the actual Kol Nidre text, which is not really in the appendix, because...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, yeah, it was the original Kol Nidre.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  In Maine, Rockland, Maine, they sing the same music that I sang 80 years ago as a child in Ivancice  Same thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11709.0,11726.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/580","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Anything new or anything either more recent than or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  God forbid.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, there’s Weisgall.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Oh, there’s Weisgall, there’s Abba, a lot of his stuff.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  They do some of my father’s things.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But nothing of Eastern European composers.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11726.0,11743.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/581","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Dunayevsky or anything like that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.  Weintraub is as close as they get to...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  What is that that we do?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Right before...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You probably do Vayomer Adonai.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s right.  Good piece.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah, it is.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11743.0,11757.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/582","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSAYER:\u003c/strong\u003e Your Jewishness in your music,  I think that it’s very obvious, but there are some, on the surface, actual aspects of big Jewish themes and little Jewish themes, and I’d like to hear you talk about that.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eFirst of all, Nine Rivers from Jordan is kind of a vast opera based on huge questions that have to do with guilt, innocence, World War II, the Holocaust, Zionism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11757.0,11790.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/583","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I entered into Nine Rivers with great hesitation. I never thought that I would get to do it because I couldn’t agree with City Opera about what had to be done. But when I got into, when the libretto began to appear, musically, I recall entering into the opening prologue with a tremendous amount of self-confidence, and sat down and wrote.  And those opening pages, you didn’t even have to copy, because I wrote them out so carefully that they didn’t need another hand.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBut as I worked into the opera, I was more than ever aware of the difficulties that it had, difficulties which I always knew existed, yet I thought that I could somehow or other either pass over, or manage to do with.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11790.0,11854.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/584","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And one of the reasons that Nine Rivers has so many parts to it, is because I was so glad to get to the end of the one, that I’d put a double-i in and start again with something else.  And I feel about Nine Rivers that that is a problem.  Oddly enough, the fact that the libretto is not absolutely clear doesn’t help matters on the stage.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11854.0,11884.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/585","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And a few, a few years ago, when I played the tapes of Six Characters, the horrible tapes, for my class, I was surprised at ‑‑ I don’t mean Six Characters, I meant Nine Rivers ‑‑ I was surprised at how much more flow that it had than I thought it had.  And that generally, I was quite pleased with the piece.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11884.0,11911.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/586","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was glad to be done with it, because there are still sections which I think I did not do well, and I wonder if I could ever rewrite, no matter how long I live.  But that certainly is the most complicated work that I ever wrote, and it has more huge swaths of music than anything else I’ve ever written.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11911.0,11936.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/587","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SAYER:  Yeah.  There’s a letter you got from Copeland, referring to the final scene, of which he says, “This is the most beautiful music I’ve ever heard of yours.”  It’s a great transforma-, it’s a transformation, a musical transformation that has a terrific, theological, if you will...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, I remember the end of Nine Rivers...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  You take, the final aria takes...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11936.0,11959.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/588","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  The Unicorn (inaudible)...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  It takes...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Ba-da-bum-bum-bum.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  Well, yes and... it takes a very disjunct, mysterious melody, and diatonicizes it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  And it’s a tremendous effect.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, I remember that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11959.0,11975.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/589","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSAYER:\u003c/strong\u003e And it’s been a model for me of the kind of thing that you do in music.  You make the drama in the music.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eBut I’m thinking of all these fascinating footnotes.  For example, the German marching song, which comes out of your love of Schubert, if you will, and Mendelssohn choral pieces.  And we all loved it.  We all sang it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11975.0,11999.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/590","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  (Sings melody with SAYER).\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That’s right, but there’s a men’s chorus, which the men’s chorus...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD.WEISGALL:  He used Shir Hama’alos in Nine Rivers, too.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  A huge chorus.  An immense, sort of grand chorus… in which you change the notes a little bit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=11999.0,12018.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/591","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSAYER:\u003c/strong\u003e I think of that as your most, in a way, autobiographical piece, because in it you pour very, very deeply thought-out and emotionally felt ideas.  You’ve always been an idea man, but in your librettos, you often... you know, you respect the librettist. I feel like you really poured your soul into that piece.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12018.0,12038.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/592","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  In so doing...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  So doing what?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Well, by putting a lot... I think you agree with Bruce’s assessment...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  ...that it is largely autobiographical.  Did you... you talked about being glad that certain parts were over.  In my mind, that seemed to contradict your earlier statements about your own high standards.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12038.0,12056.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/593","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  I don’t think so.  He just said he listened to it, and thought it was terrific.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you were...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I was just glad to be finished.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  I think that the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  So you don’t think the problems are musical.  They were...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12056.0,12068.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/594","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSAYER:\u003c/strong\u003e I think that if we had lived in the super-title era, when people couldn’t hear the words, and they had everything to do with this sort of complicated, phantasmagoric...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12068.0,12085.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/595","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  It made sense, if you knew the libretto.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  It’s funny that you mention that, because I am convinced that part of Esther’s big success was the super-titles.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  Absolutely.  Absolutely.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  That people could follow... I mean, it’s... they are idea operas, there’s no question about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12085.0,12099.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/596","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eD. WEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e I remember learning that libretto, just because it was in our lives.  And it, the opera made total sense, if you knew the words.  If you understood... I mean, it may not have made kerchunk-kerchunk-kerchunk sense that way, but it certainly made emotional sense.  And...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12099.0,12118.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/597","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Yeah, but the opera also did set a record for using the most number of languages in one libretto.  I think it was about eight.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yes, but if it had been in super-titles, then we would have, you know, they would have been singing in Hungarian, and we would have been speaking the language perfectly.  It wouldn’t have mattered.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12118.0,12131.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/598","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  But you had Hebrew, you had German, English, Arabic...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Latin.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Latin.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  French.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12131.0,12148.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/599","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eSAYER:\u003c/strong\u003e I’d like to ask you how you feel about the problems of writing music for the synagogue and writing concert music.  You always talked about the fact that you loved the Bloch Sacred Service so much.  I did too, and I actually wanted to write ‑‑ I was so inspired by it and you that I wanted to write my own Sacred Service, and I really, really did.  But I had to learn Hebrew first, which I guess kept me from doing it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12148.0,12166.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/600","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I know your complicated feelings about the Bloch, but you really... from practically the first weeks I studied with you, you talked about wanting to write a service, and why weren’t you commissioned to write a service, and why weren’t the major Jewish composers of America commissioned to write major sacred works.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12166.0,12195.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/601","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, there’s several things involved, I think.  I don’t think the Jews as Jews in the United States feel that there’s any Jewish music lacking, or if there is lacking, that it’s important.  People who go to the synagogue don’t really care about the music.  ‘Cause if they did, they wouldn’t put up with what they have.  Now, and this is not just one side, this is the whole Jewish musical scene in the synagogue generally.  If people felt that we should have change, we should.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12195.0,12223.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/602","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, why there aren’t... why major American Jewish composers don’t write major American Jewish work is ‘cause they’re not commissioned.  And the reason they’re not commissioned is because the people who do the commissioning don’t want to spend the money.  It’s a very, very simple fact.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12223.0,12241.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/603","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And... well, there is one other thing.  If they commission it and they don’t like it, they’re likely to be stung and feel badly about that, but that’s one of their, that’s one of the risks you have to take.  But I don’t know what can be done about that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12241.0,12260.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/604","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I’m writing a synagogue... no, I’m not writing a synagogue service, I’m writing a group of pieces which will constitute, which will constitute, if we’re lucky, a kind of service.  It’s for the Conservative synagogue, which means that the text is different from what it would be were it for the Reform synagogue, and of course, totally different from the Orthodox.  I take certain liberties with text, and I also take certain liberties with what it is I’m going to compose or not compose.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12260.0,12297.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/605","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This work that I’m doing now, some of it sounds like it was left over for the piece commissioned originally by Temple Emanuel, of which later canceled its commission.  No clear reason was ever given to me why, except that... well, somebody said it was unaccess-... inaccessible, and terribly difficult.  Well, those are two very good reasons.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12297.0,12322.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/606","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e Along this line...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12322.0,12347.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/607","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e And by the way, let’s get back to money.  That, the piece that I am doing now I am doing for considerably less than for something else I was offered as a spec to do some choral, some large choral pieces.  But I didn’t accept that idea, ‘cause I never thought the money would come through.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12347.0,12373.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/608","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e The Temple Emanuel commission, was that the first request, even, and from your point of view, the first attempt at a unified, single service in the Bloch model?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12373.0,12385.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/609","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eWEISGALL:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.  If the Emanuel thing had stayed on, it would have been a Reform service, which I must say, from a text point of view, has a great deal of sense.  The Conservative Friday evening service is very, very loose, and it’s too long in certain parts and too short in certain others.  But if the Emanuel thing had stayed on, it would have been the first Bloch, neo-Blochian type of large work.  ‘Cause they were also asking for it with largish accompaniment.  The piece that I am writing now is with, only with organ.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12385.0,12433.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/610","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e One of the things that has always interested me is the question why composers haven’t been drawn to address the liturgy.  And I don’t necessarily mean the Friday evening or Saturday morning, but let’s say the High Holy Days liturgy.  Purely as an artistic medium.  Not even with the intention ‑‑ unless a synagogue would want to ‑‑ but otherwise, but not with the intention of...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12433.0,12457.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/611","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  But why write a piece that involves a fairly largish number of performers or of difficulty if you’re not, if a, you don’t get paid; b, you don’t get a chance that you’re gonna be heard.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, what I’m getting at...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12457.0,12474.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/612","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I think that for a composer to sit down and write a piece for the liturgy of Rosh Hashanah without knowing that it’s going to be done and done decently, he’s a damn fool.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I’m talking about, let’s say, an open commission.  In other words, let’s assume that, I mean, there have been plenty of cases where composers had an opportunity to write a large oratorio-type work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12474.0,12497.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/613","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, where are these opportunities?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But they didn’t... no one has then chosen the Hebrew liturgy as their text.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s not so.  I was asked to write a... I was asked to write a piece with “Jewish content,” so I took two poems by Yehuda Halevi and made them into a largish work.  But that was not as a commission.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12497.0,12522.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/614","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  What piece was that?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Love’s Wounded\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Those are secular poems.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Halevi.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, they’re secular, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But why would you think, with all the many, many composers around, that no one has taken, let’s say, the nusaḥ of Rosh Hashanah as pure art music?  Not as gebrauchsmusik.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12522.0,12547.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/615","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  But the text for the music of Rosh Hashanah is so tremendous, you’ve got a 16-hour opera.  I mean, what are you gonna... if you’re gonna do music for Rosh Hashanah.  I’m presuming you mean mussaf.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, aren’t you gonna start with mussaf, uh Kaddish, and then you go onto the Avos, and then you go into U’nesane tokef, and Rosh Hashanah, and all those things.  My God, you got huge pieces right there.  It’s a Wagner opera.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12547.0,12576.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/616","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Is that more than a mass has?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Except the mass keeps repeating itself, so...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, no.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Is that more than a Requiem?  Is that a greater piece than a...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  You mean, in terms of words?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yeah.  They’re much longer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12576.0,12588.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/617","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  And I’m not counting the three main sections of the Rosh Hashanah service ‑‑ the Malkhuyos, Zikhronos, and Shofarot.  And I mean, those are some huge, huge texts.  That... are enough to frighten anyone off.  And especially if the music is somewhat demanding.  Very difficult job.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You did it instrumentally, though.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  In a way, you did it instrumentally, with the T’kiatot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12588.0,12621.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/618","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah, well, in a way only.  Not too successfully.  I’m not... I’m not sure whether I’m displeased with the piece because of its performance, which I think I am.  \u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I don’t know, Bruce, how you feel about it, we’ve talked about this before.  For some reason, I love that piece.  And it’s not one of your favorites.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12621.0,12641.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/619","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, because I’m unhappy with what I...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  With the performance.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But you... were you unhappy then?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You’re sure?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yeah.  Mmm-mmm.  I mean, certainly I didn’t display any lack of enthusiasm, but I was.  I came home that evening, and I called somebody and told them how upset I was.  And you know, the funny thing, looking back over my entire career, the best orchestral performance I have had of a work of mine like that is the Love’s Wounded from the Baltimore Symphony.  The orchestra sounds great, the singer is good, and I think the piece was...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Who is the singer?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12641.0,12690.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/620","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  The singer was what’s-his-name?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  David Hamilton?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  David Hamilton.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  David Hamilton.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  So what you’ve done is in the absence of a commission to write a service, which you’ve wanted to do your whole life, and now are doing, finally doing it, you’ve written all kinds of other Jewish, specifically Jewish pieces.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12690.0,12710.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/621","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah.  I’m taking what’s from hangover from the Temple Emanuel services, sticking them into this, which has been done before.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Are you...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  You have an honorable tradition, you’re working from.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Believe me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12710.0,12725.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/622","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003eLEVIN:\u003c/strong\u003e Now, there are some composers, we won’t mention any names, we know who they are,  who fancy themselves in the first rank of composers, and also in the group that knows something about the synagogue, who write for the synagogue and say that there is no need, in fact, there shouldn’t be any constraint whatsoever in terms of Minḥag Ashkenaz, what they, what we call, and I hate this, a misnomer of nusaḥ.  Doesn’t mean anything, but whatever ‑‑ nusaḥ hat'filla.  But the particular melodical and modal patterns.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12725.0,12765.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/623","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But you don’t feel that way, do you?  I mean, you think they should be preserved in whatever harmonic language you want to use, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  How you gonna go about that with the... oh, this is for Friday night service.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12765.0,12778.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/624","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yeah.  Actually, I’m even avoiding the Friday night.  I’ve written the V’shomru already.  But I’m avoiding the Friday night, and I’m writing the Hashkiveinu at the moment.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  For Friday night or for weekday?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, same words.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12778.0,12795.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/625","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  No, but I mean the nusaḥ will be for Shabbes?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, it’s not nusaḥ, it’s “melodia Weisgalliana”.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Is it totally free?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What does that mean?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I mean, when you come to the brucha at the end...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12795.0,12809.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/626","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I’m not gonna, I’m gonna leave that out.  I’m gonna leave the brucha out.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So that then the cantor could pick up and go...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s... we’ll let the cantor pick up.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So in that sense, that’s purely traditional, because...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...that’s what...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12809.0,12822.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/627","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Actually, the text, as far as I remember it, I’m going to set one of the opening psalms, I forget which one, and then I’ve got a Bar’chu and a Sh’ma, and a fairly complicated Mi khamokha, very jazzy.  A V’shamru, and now I’m doing the Hashkiveinu.  And from there on, I’ll probably go into Magen avos, or something like that. And end up, well I don’t... what?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Adon olam?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12822.0,12860.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/628","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Well, he may want Yigdal.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  A Yigdal?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  But now you said you’re starting with a Barchu.  What I’m getting at, it’s a perfect example.  Will the brucha be totally free, or will you follow the nusaḥ in some fashion?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  It’s free, but you recognize it as a Barchu.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12860.0,12877.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/629","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  And you recognize that some skeleton of the Shabbes nusaḥ?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Hmm-mmm.  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You just mentioned something about jazz.  What do you think of a jazz service?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12877.0,12893.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/630","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  I don’t know.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Well, actually, I’m looking for it here ‑‑ somewhere, Martin Bookspan talked with you a long time ago, I don’t know...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Oh, yeah.  I was at that interview.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  About 23, 24 years ago.  And somewhere he asked you about that, about jazz, and I think ‑‑ yeah, here it is.  No, about rock.  I shouldn’t confuse the two, because jazz is serious art form and rock is garbage, in my opinion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12893.0,12916.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/631","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But anyway, it says, you said you’re only offended by the second-rate.  You said you don’t think it’s gonna save the synagogue, but if it’s good rock, if it’s effective, if the rock turns out to be good music, I don’t care, but you just object to music that’s “just bad.”  Do you still subscribe to that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12916.0,12941.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/632","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes.  And of course, who’s gonna decide what’s good or bad music?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  You.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Right.  Right.  No, I haven’t said anything new in an awfully long time.  I said... my ideas I stick to pretty closely.  Not too many of my students complain of the fact that I change my mind all the time, they can’t tell what I’m thinking.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12941.0,12968.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/633","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  What about Esther?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  She’s fine.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Your triumph of the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  She sends her best.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...of the century, and you consider that a Judaically-related work?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I’ve noticed I don’t say Jewish music, there’s no such thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12968.0,12985.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/634","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  No, of course.  It is, of course it is, I mean, the theme, the whole thing.  Sure.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  You want to talk at all about The Wall?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Not since yesterday, I don’t think I want to talk about it.  Because I’ve encountered some problems.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=12985.0,13008.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/635","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Because the... I mean aside from the obvious Jewish subject, the... to me, there...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That is not a problem.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  No, I know it’s not a problem.  It strikes me as a Nine Rivers From Jordan that would, that to me, at least, having read it, is clearer.  But again, maybe all of that turns on how something is produced, I don’t know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13008.0,13030.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/636","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Clearer than Nine Rivers?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Well, just...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Different from Nine Rivers.\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  There’s no problem with The Wall...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  It just moves chronologically.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ...at the beginning?  All of ‘em get killed, and ten of ‘em escape at the end ‑‑ that’s the story of the opera.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And you play Hatikvah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  But I don’t know whether that makes an opera.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  So the problems you’re having are dramatic.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.  Operatic problems...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Operatic...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  ...are dramatic problems.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13030.0,13056.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/637","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  No, I mean, they’re not...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I know.  I just want to emphasize that for me, an operatic problem is a dramatic problem.  Whether if the music is good or bad, makes no difference.  How does it work as music dramatically?  If it works, it works.  If it doesn’t, it doesn’t.  It’s very hard to put your finger on it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13056.0,13076.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/638","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I have... I’m surprised that I’m having this problem at the moment, but then not really surprised.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  We can come back to the operas, but there’s just something that just struck me now that we haven’t mentioned, and it’s very important. And that is Israel. Have you had much contact through your career with Israeli composers?\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No. The only Israeli composer I really know is Joseph Tal, and I don’t really know him but I nominated him for the American Academy and had him elected, fortunately. \u003cbr\u003eBut I’ve had not contact with Israeli composers or their music. And no piece of mine has ever been performed in Israel.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I was just about to...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13076.0,13123.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/639","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Isn’t that strange?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I don’t know whether it’s strange or not.  No piece of mine has been performed at the Metropolitan, either.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  But it’s stranger.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I do think it’s strange, yes.  I do think it’s strange, especially in the days when absolutely every American composer was invited to stay in Israel for five or six months, except me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13123.0,13144.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/640","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Well, I don’t know whether it’s because the composers... first place, there’s not an awful lot of performance of American composers, American Jewish composers...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, I know there isn’t.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...because they play a lot of their own music.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Exactly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13144.0,13158.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/641","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  But, and those that there are, that what you’re talking about are people who are more... fall into that ridiculous category of accessible, you know...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  No, only some of them.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  ...Bernstein, had the connections...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, but on the other hand, they invited Rothberg, and Milton Babbitt, and...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13158.0,13174.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/642","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Babbitt has been?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah, and those people.  And Warren and...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Is it because they have political contacts or connections?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Yes, I would think so.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Maybe.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  I think so.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  But I don’t want to get into that, because that’s not the kind of thing I want to talk about, because it doesn’t solve any problems.  Doesn’t even elucidate them.  Doesn’t....","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13174.0,13195.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/643","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, I’m astounded at the fact that in 1994 there was not a single song of mine sung in New York.  Not even a song.  Now, that’s very unpleasant to hear, and unpleasant to listen to, and it’s painful to the listener, as well as to the person who does the speaking.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13195.0,13214.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/644","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SAYER:  In ‘94... I don’t think that’s correct, actually.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL: I knew somebody would say that.\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  Well, your Golden Peacock was done at Queens College, to the dedication of the Lefrak Concert Hall.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Was that ‘95?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  ‘94, cause we’re...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  That was ‘94, that’s right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13214.0,13230.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/645","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  ‘95 just started three weeks ago.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Excuse me, I’m wrong.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eSAYER:  And then Queens College produced another concert, a tribute to you, in which there was a lot of Jewish music.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Eat, eat your words.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13230.0,13242.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/646","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  That’s gonna get me my ASCAP raise, those two concerts at Queens College.  And then Kansas City, there was...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  A whole weekend.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  A whole evening of mine, yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  There would be many composers who have had songs performed this past year who would gladly trade places with someone about whom it’s been generally said by the major critics that the most recent opera was the major opera in the whole post war period of American composers. Period.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13242.0,13268.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/647","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Yes, I’m glad you like it ‑‑ just don’t tell me how good or how bad it is.  Don’t compare.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  He doesn’t think of himself in those terms.  I think that one of the difficulties for him in the post-War context, is that he does not think of himself of his time.  He thinks of himself as part of a continuum that began somewhere in Central Europe in the 18th century, 17th century, perhaps.  And went wherever it had to go.  So...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13268.0,13307.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/648","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Dallapiccola once said to me, he said, “You know, I’m so happy who I am, because I began with Monteverde and I’m ending up here.”  And he was happy, too, with Ulysses.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, I think you feel...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13307.0,13326.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/649","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  But, you’ve got to be an Italian to feel that continuum.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Well, you feel, you know, a continuum...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  In the air, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  In the air.  It’s part of the way you compose.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  It’s your roots again.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Yeah.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Your rootless roots.  You’re an orchid, you’re an air plant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13326.0,13341.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/650","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  Well, of course, a case can be made that that is a manifestly Jewish experience.  The rootless roots.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Absolutely.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Now that I think of it, right?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Absolutely.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  I mean, that’s the existential Moses.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  The Wandering Jew, my favorite plant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13341.0,13356.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/651","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  You told me a story once, a long time ago, about the man who bragged about being an Am Ha’aretz, because he was such a... what’s the...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The story?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Yeah.  I don’t remember it.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Oh, a rich Jew takes a poor friend of his into his library, and takes down all the leather-bound volumes.  And the, then the poor man looks at this and says, “Yah, ikh kan zehen, das ihr vater var ein gross am ha’aretz,” and the rich guy says, “Ein vortreffen…[?].”","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13356.0,13389.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/652","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"LEVIN:  You want to translate any of that, or...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Could you translate that for those of us who...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  “I can see that your father was a great am ha’aretz.”  Do you know what an am ha’aretz was?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  A man of the world?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  No, an ignoramus.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  An ignoramus.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  Oh.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  The other one says, “Ein vortreppen,” a very prominent ignoramus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13389.0,13413.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/653","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  An internationally-renowned meeskite.  Will you just tell the story of Bill Schuman’s work, The Mighty Casey, and your role in it, and your little vendetta with Harold Schonberg?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I did... what vendetta did I have?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  Well, the review, the wonderful review that...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13413.0,13431.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/654","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Oh.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  But start from the beginning.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Well, I, Bill Schuman, some group was doing Bill Schuman’s opera, and they asked me to direct it.  And I, I was directing in those days.  And I agreed, and we worked on it, and then all of sudden, at the very end, the guy who was playing the umpire became ill.  And we couldn’t find anybody else, and so I said, “Well, I’ll sing the part, and see what happens.”  So we went to the performance, and I indeed sang the part.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  In what name?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  And what was your name on the program?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13431.0,13465.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/655","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"WEISGALL:  Siegfried Vovermann was my name on the program.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eLEVIN:  Why did you need a stage name?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  What?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  He didn’t want to be...\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I didn’t want to be... Hugo Weisgall, composer, was not right singing, what’s Casey’s...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13465.0,13479.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/656","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"J. WEISGALL:  Casey at the Bat, The Mighty Casey.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  Casey at the Bat.  And the next day, Harold Schonberg says, “It’s a very good performance, and we encountered a new singer, Siegfried Vovermann, and we hope we hear more of him around.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  And if he had known that it was Hugo Weisgall?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  I don’t know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13479.0,13493.0"},{"id":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737/transcript/29299/annotation/657","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"D. WEISGALL:  Probably would have said, “What a lousy voice.  He sounded just like Berg, all this atonal crap.”\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eWEISGALL:  That’s the story, isn’t it?\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eJ. WEISGALL:  It’s a good story, yes.\u003cbr\u003e\u003cbr\u003eD. WEISGALL:  It’s a good story.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://milken.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1159/collection_resources/43646/file/116737#t=13493.0,13516.416"}]}]}]}